unreality

thanks As for the Villains' win con... well I thought of that, but it'd be pretty tough for a group of 3 to kill 12 others (9 Adventurers and 3 Bandits), especially because the Villains don't even kill reliably each night, they just have the Agent of The Hand and his/her special hand attacks [only 3 total], the Mind Flayer's puppet-mind-control thing, and the dragonbreath - so three separate and unique methods that are kind of like killing (although the Mind Flayer does more: it's like it kills one of the opponents but adds one of yours, so a net gain of +2)... so maybe on second thought they could have the potential to be the last ones standing I'll have to think about it (I'll hold the period button down until I come to a conclusion) ................................................................................ ........ [done ;D] Hmmmm... the Villains' lack of role-discovery ability is suddenly disconcerting, especially because of the Mind Flayer's requirement to have the identity + role. Dang.. I was originally thinking that the Villains could have a certain group of people they have to kill. Not sure. Maybe a certain randomly generated list of roles? Or list of identities? But then does the Mind Flayer attack count as a kill? Hmmm... now I like the idea of having the Villains (including the Villains and all Mind Flayer puppets) be the last ones standing to win, if I give them a way to gain more insight on enemies' roles edit: then there's the topic of: should Mind Flayer puppet's retain their previous ability? I don't think so

I thought it was: 5 6 7 8 - Try to keep your thumb straight although I've also heard: 5 6 7 8 - I use this thumb to mast*rbate

On an unrelated topic, a pet peeve I have in mafia games is use of genderized roles. If you've noticed, all of my mafia games (with the exception of the shortlived LOSt mini-mafia) have roles that are not specific characters from movies/books/etc, they're more general and gender unspecific. For Jumper Mafia, I didn't use characters from the movie (although I adapted some of the character roles from the movie), and.. yeah It kinda bugs me when male or female characters are used and are separate from the Brainden usernames that play them. It just extends the requested suspension-of-belief in the storyline, and removes all feeling of immersion and character attachment, especially if your own personal gender happens to be different than that of the 'role' (more like character) that you play. I know that if you are basing something off of a story that you didn't make up, it's hard to degenderize, but I did something like that for Jumper Mafia, generalizing some and mostly making up new roles, because I didn't take the exact events from the movie but rather the general concept: people, called Jumpers, who can teleport, and other people, called Paladins, who are zealots that hunt and kill the Jumpers. This is basically all I took from the movie 'Jumper'. Anyway, I'll end my rant now, I know for some things (like Princess Bride) that it's near-impossible to de-personify and make roles, not characters, but it's just a little pet peeve I have that I thought I'd share

Yeah, good idea, if we have less people than we need btw DMS do you have a program yet? Just curious

the most important part of Mafia is not the informed minority (this varies a lot in Mafia games), but the uninformed majority (the core basis of the game). If you have two teams of roughly equal size, don't expect the gameplay to be the same - players may behave like it is a Mafia game out of habit, but clever players will probably realize the difference and capitalize. You can make it any way you want of course, this is just a friendly warning LIS: I thought of having that for Viral Mafia, but in general I'm against anything that involves specifically dead players. Once you're dead in Mafia, you should stay dead While a spying role can still spy on you of course [depends on the game and role, which reminds me I need to clarify that for the Thief, thanks for reminding me ;D] So does anyone have any suggestions for Mafia VIII so far? (the current version is on post 798) I'm going to figure out the 'X' part in the Bandit's wincon, but I still need suggestions for the Villains' win condition [edit: grammar]

1 2 3 4 I declare a thumb war!!!!

okay, I've finished the Bandits I just haven't decided how much gold ingots the Bandits need to amass in order to win. And then I need to decide the Villains' win condition Mafia VIII - Medieval Mafia Adventurers - The Psion - The Knight - The Thief - The Tank - The Druid - The Dragonslayer - The Herbalist - The Royal Emissary - The City Guard Bandits - The Highwayman - The Deadbolt Sniper - The Footpad Villains - The Agent of The Hand - The Mind Flayer - The Bronzefire Dragon Role Abilities Adventurers * The Psion: a warrior of innate mental prowess... they have a mind so powerful they can manipulate others with minimal effort. Because of this, they are immune to the Mind Flayer, and are also very persuasive, giving them double voting power. Each day, the Psion chooses one other player to also give double voting power (the person is alerted of this fact)... and if the chosen person is a Mind Flayer puppet, they are killed at the end of the day * The Knight - goes on quests. Each Adventurer (other than the Knight) has a quest that only they know. They can PM me at any time, and immediately after the next day/night post, I will send the quest to the Knight for completion. The Knight has no knowledge of any quests until he/she receives them, and they can choose not to do a quest. Rewards of completing a quest & changes that happen afterward are detailed in the quest description * The Thief - a sly, roguish individual with a knack for ending up in places where they don't belong. Because of this, the Thief often learns useful information. At the beginning of the game, they have a key choice to make, two different paths to follow: ** The Flambuoyant Thief - hangs around in the upper echelons of society, learning who the newest fashionable villains are. Each night, they learn one person that is either a Bandit or Villain, but they are not told what specific faction or role ** The Shadow Thief - hangs around in... ventilation ducts. They can visit any person they so choose (at night of course) and find an ingenious way into their home, at which point they learn the chosen person's exact role ** Once the Thief makes their choice, it is final. Furthermore, they do not learn anything until they make their choice, so they should probably do so in the first night *** Regardless of the chosen path, if the Thief is arrested by the City Guard, they may, in the day following their arrest, choose to break out (which happens in the day post) * The Tank - a combat-loving, fray-entering, battle-berserking, war-cry-yelling brute-force barbaric fighter, who enjoys kicking down doors and slaughtering "evil stuff". Most importantly, the Tank serves an integral function in any group of Adventurers: the damage absorber. The Tank's massive store of health allows them to take blows that would've been lethal to their weaker allies. Each night, the Tank can (if they want) choose one person that they then protect for the whole night, absorbing damage. If they don't choose anyone, it's as if they chose themselves, essentially. If the chosen person is attacked, the Tank absorbs the blow. The Tank can absorb three hits before dying, and these include attacks on the Tank as well as multiple attacks in the same night. The Tank is as vulnerable as anyone else during lynchings * The Druid - the Druid is a master of the natural forces of the universe, utilizing all aspects of nature, from flora & fauna to weather itself. The Druid can, if they so please, call upon the fearsome and awesome power Nature to kill any specified person. If the Druid chooses not to kill, they have no voting power the next day * The Dragonslayer - has a very focused, one-track-mind: dragonslaying! Basically they live to hunt and kill fiery winged magical lizards. The Dragonslayer is immune to the Bronzefire's dragonbreath, and each night, they traverse the realm, seeking to find their draconic nemesis. If they find the Bronzefire Dragon, the Dragon dies, despite any saving role that may be involved. If the Dragonslayer finds the Druid, they get BTSC with the Druid * The Herbalist - the Herbalist grew up in an apothecary and knows every herb, every root, every remedy and every potion. Each night, the Herbalist can make a different concoction and infuse it to the person of their choice: ** Panacea Potion - saves someone's life, except for dragonbreath ** Mindguard Salve - saves someone against the Mind Flayer ** Firesbane Poultice - saves someone against dragonbreath ** The Herbalist may administer any of their cures to themselves, and there are no other limits on who they can save * The Royal Emissary - the RE acts as a tagalong agent of the King, an ambassador to all lands foreign that the Adventurers (and various infiltrating baddies) may venture. Because of the Royal Emissary's extensive career as a courier and messenger-taker for the High Courts, they can carry messages between any two players. A player that wishes the RE to carry a message will PM me the message and the target player. I will, as soon as I get it, forward it to the RE, who may alter it in any way they so please, and then send it to ANY player they so please (through me). The RE cannot otherwise send or receive messages. Each player can only request the services of the Royal Emissary once * The City Guard - this astute and vigilant watchman is quite the upholder of justice. Each night, they can jail one [supposedly suspicious] person, arresting them in the night post. The jailed victim cannot vote, be voted for, use BTSC, use a role ability (except for the Thief's jailbreak ability), or have a role ability used on them (except for the Highwayman's jailbreak ability). However, the jailed person is allowed to post on the thread and discuss (but no BTSC!). The City Guard holds them for the following day and following night at minimum, and if they do not choose to jail someone else the next night, they may hold them prisoner indefinitely. However, the City Guard may only hold one person prisoner at a time, so if they choose someone new, they release the old prisoner as they arrest the new one. Furthermore, the jailed person can PM me a message, which I pass on to the City Guard, and vice versa with the City Guard messaging the prisoner ** Note that the Thief can choose to break out of jail if they want to (happens in the day post) and the Highwayman can choose to break anyone out of jail (also happens in the day post). I won't elaborate much and it will be unclear whether the person escaped because they were the Thief or because the Highwayman rescued them Bandits * The Highwayman - during the day, if someone is under arrest by the City Guard, the Highwayman may choose to break them out, which occurs in the day post. The Highwayman can only break OTHER people out: if the Highwayman is in jail, he or she cannot break themselves out * The Deadbolt Sniper - the Sniper is the main distance assassin that the Bandits use, but they are also a skilled detective and can uncover clues with the slightest glance, probably from training their eye at the sight of a crossbow. The Deadbolt Sniper can learn one player's exact role each night * The Footpad - the Footpad is a common street ruffian, a Bandit thug. Each day they can mug any player they want (happens in the day post). They get money equal to exactly HALF of the monetary amount listed for the player's role in the Bandits' win description. Furthermore, if the Footpad mugs the Herbalist, they get one of the three random cures that the Herbalist uses, and the Footpad gets ONE use of that to use on any player on any night. ** If the Footpad mugs the same person a second time, they are caught and killed Villains * The Agent of The Hand - the Agent of The Hand is a skilled mage/assassin that works for a mysterious society known as The Hand. The Agent can enchant their hand with powerful energy which can be used to smite down foes. The Agent has three energy-based attacks that they can use throughout the game (at night). They can only use each ability once, and cannot use two in the same night: ** Plasma Hand - a cloud of charged ions forms around the Agent's hand, which can be used to deal fatal blows... but not against the magical defenses of the Adventurers. The Plasma Hand only works against the Bandits. If it fails, it is still usable at a later time ** Lightning Hand - blazing arcs of electricity zap around the Agent's hand, allowing him or her to smite down Adventurers (but not Bandits, who are accustomed to storms and have grounded boots). If it fails, it is still usable at a later time ** Vortex Hand - kills anyone and everyone, without fail * The Mind Flayer - the Mind Flayer is a strange subterranean humanoid creature with light bluish skin and a tentacled face with eyes that glow with a menacing intensity. The Mind Flayer is an expert at probing into victims' minds and taking control of their neurological processes, effectively making them puppets. The Mind Flayer can do this once per night, turning any Adventurer or Bandit into a minion of the Mind Flayer. The player who is puppetized joins the Villains and gains BTSC with them. Nobody is aware that anything happened. There is one catch: the Mind Flayer cannot just probe anyone's mind. They must have extensive knowledge of the person's identity beforehand; ie, they must know the person's role. When they PM me the request, they include the target's role, and the mind control fails if they are wrong... also if they are wrong, they suffer a mental cataclysm. The first time they are fine and recover easily and quickly. However, on the Mind Flayer's second cataclysm, they die * The Bronzefire Dragon - this temperamental drake has the ability to breathe intense fire upon its chosen victim each night. The person breathed upon is notified, as well as a 50% chance that the dragonbreath event will make its way into the night post, which of course makes the knowledge public and undeniably truthful. The dragonbreath victim will die at the conclusion of the following night (not the same night), unless healed with a Firesbane Poultice the same night as the burning OR the following night. The Dragonslayer is immune to the dragonbreath attack, but this isn't revealed until the moment of death. If the Dragonslayer is breathed upon and the 50% chance of NOT making it public occurred, then the Dragonslayer 'not dying' is NOT put into the following night's night post. If someone was breathed upon and it was made public, no matter what happens the following night with it will be shown. If someone was breathed upon and it was NOT made public, then: if the Herbalist saves them, it is NOT put in the night post, but the Herbalist is PMed and informed that they saved someone (and the victim is informed that they were saved too, and so is the Bronzefire Dragon). If the victim is not saved and dies of burn wounds, then of course it is part of the night post Faction Abilities Adventurers: (and the group as a whole of course) standard lynch. Tie = no execution that day. No Adventurers have BTSC unless otherwise stated in their role description Bandits: BTSC, kill each night Villains: BTSC, no overall Faction Ability Win Conditions Adventurers: lynch & kill all Bandits and Villains Bandits: amass as much gold as possible. After killing a player (or at least being part of killing a player), the Bandits raid their body and possessions for gold. Each role has a different amount of gold expected to be on them. The Psion, Knight, Thief and Royal Emissary each have 10 gold ingots. The Tank, Dragonslayer and City Guard each have 6 gold ingots. The Druid, Herbalist and Agent of The Hand each have 4 gold ingots. The Mind Flayer carries no gold, but the Bronzefire Dragon has a dragonlike treasure horde of 12 gold ingots. To get gold from the Tank, the Tank must actually die, not just 'take a hit'. The Bandits win if they get X gold ingots Villains: ?

Answer time

yeah Well it was a lucky guess in that case; as the top card does in fact have the best chances

I'm almost done perfecting 'the Awesome' (I might change the name hehe) ;D btw this is the roster: 1) unreality 2) Frost 3) dms172 4) Mekal 5) FOTH 6) Prime? 7) 8) possibly unreality #2 I know that Taliesin is busy, but BL is checking it out ;D

when there are two major teams plotted against each other of about equal size, it ceases to be Mafia, because there is no claim of "good guys". There has to be some non-BTSC team that has the overwhelming majority, which thus everyone must pretend to be in the thread or get voted out. In game theory it's known as "uninformed majority" while the mafia and possibly other groups are called "informed minority", and is the game theory basis of Mafia. Two teams of equal size pitted against each other no longer is mafia. Just a heads up For Mafia VIII, I'm adding stuff to the City Guard role and some other roles

Good work so far

I agree; however in essence (at least in this game), the City Guard is actually a killing role. Think about it from the other direction: the victims have a chance to get out of their predicament But I appreciate your input and being the jail sucks... so here's a couple of ideas: - the jailed person can still communicate & post on the thread. Why not? They just can't vote of course - the jailed person can have PMs sent to the City Guard, via me, and the CG can send PMs to the jailed person (also via me) The second option allows an experienced and/or innocent and/or tricky player to buy themselves out of the jail, while the first allows them to contribute to the game while they're jailed. Plus the Highwayman can free people, either to: (a) free fellow Bandits, or (b) try to frame the freed person by seeming like the Highwayman wanted them free which is also why the Thief may or may not be hesitant to break themselves out [i will make it unclear whether it was a Thief escape or outside-assisted breakout] I think these changes are pretty good, thanks for giving me the heads up about this If you approve, I will put them into the City Guard role description ;D oh and do you have any ideas about baddie wincons or Bandit roles?

haha, American law should just get rid of the "suing" thing. And I did hear about the coffee spill lawsuit, but not the thief thing - that's hilarious

I'm my own grandfather! I mean... uh... I didn't say that

any more takers?

oh yeah, duh, I forgot the most important part: after they assemble once (ie, make either 1 producer [if they're a drone] or 1 of each [if they're a producer]) then for the rest of their minutes they do other swarmbot stuff ;D (If they just reproduced constantly, nothing would get done ) Sorry for omitting that crucial part great job so far, guys

here's a lot more: I need some help with a lot of the Bandit role stuff as well as the win condition of the baddie groups. Feel free to post here or PM me privately

Frost is correct The OP has it all: there is no absolute addressing; rather, all nodes are relative to the current line (which is '0', the next line is 1, then 2, etc, and the line before you is -1, the line before that is -2, etc). The VNA loops around, so that line 205 is the same thing as line 5 the two programs start at random points, but their opening lines are at least 40 nodes away from each other (and thus at most 160 nodes away, meaning the other program is 40-160 away from your first line). Your instruction pointer begins at the first line of your program and executes one node per round, advancing to the next round unless otherwise told by JUMP or SHIFT. If your program hits a BOMB, it dies. There is no distinction between commands made by you or commands made by your opponent or the original BLANK commands: once the programs are put in the VNA they are all the same. The battles are between 2 programs at a time in a bracket tournament formation to decide the winner. A "battle" consists of multiple games, the first program to win at least 7 games and at least 2 more games than the opponent wins the battle (to make sure that random starting position wasn't a factor in deciding the best program) Remember that I removed the rand() function ;D does that answer all of your questions?

this is what I have so far: Mafia VIII - Medieval Mafia Adventurers - The Psion - The Knight - The Thief - The Tank - The Druid - The Dragonslayer - The Herbalist - The Royal Emissary - The City Guard Bandits - The Highwayman - The Deadbolt Sniper - The Footpad Villains - The Agent of The Hand - The Mind Flayer - The Bronzefire Dragon

I'm not sure... your diagram is pretty confusing. Here's a hint:

Wow I love re-contradicting myself... the next Mafia that I'll host will either be Mafia VII or VIII (skipping 7), ie, classic Mafia But like I've said, that won't be for a while ;D

I had an idea for something called Viral Mafia... I doubt I'd use this, but I started on it and thought the concept was pretty cool the computer theme and "banning vote" was semi-based upon... ~~~ remember that 'Brainden Mafia' game I made a while back? I'm thinking of actually hosting it It wouldn't require any stories (you really couldn't, I don't know what you would do). Anyway: I may change the Leopard part, but the rest would be mostly the same. I like the Encrypter role from Viral Mafia, so I may incorporate something of that sort

There is a deep underlying pattern to answer at least #1 & #3 and will probably help you a lot on 2a and 2b