Rat Hunt Mafia

[Molly Mae]

Roles:

The Boss -- Organises jobs and knows all RID combinations, but does not know factions. Has self vote manip of x1 or x2.

The Boss' Son -- In charge of the job and can redirect any player.

Mr White -- An old man, formerly a doctor of medicine. Cannot be bad. May save one target from the NK per night. If he successfully saves a baddie, he becomes bad.

Mr Black -- The quiet, observant type. May Role Spy any player. Does not learn faction.

Mr Gray -- A loudmouth who likes to tell stories. He can keep a player occupied for the night, stopping their action. (Block)

Mr Green -- A ruthless killer chosen by The Boss to keep things orderly. Has a kill every night.

Mr Brown -- A man with connections. If he is ever targeted by a member of the opposite faction, he is told which role targeted him.

Mr Tech -- A tech whiz who can tap communications. He chooses a player or role and receives a random five word string from the last pm sent that night by them to the host.

---

2 vs 6 mini-mafia in the partial style of Reservoir Dogs. Note: This is NOT a Reservoir Dogs mafia. Heh.

Every player is assigned a name that they know each other by (in this case, though, your real name is the colour and your assigned name is your board name--e.g., maurice).

You have completed a job that went south quickly. You now suspect that there are police among you. Someone set you up and you're out for blood.

Two roles will randomly be assigned as undercover cops. They may be any two roles excluding Mr White.

Rules: Baddies get BTSC + NK (unstoppable, save by save). When a player is lynched, their faction is revealed, but not their role.

OOA:

Block > Kill > Redirect

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. Plasmid (reserved, if he wants it)

2.

3.

4.

5.

6.

7.

8.

[Guest]

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. Plasmid (reserved, if he wants it)

2.

3.

4.

5.

6. maurice

7. Auramyna

8.

[Guest]

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. Plasmid (reserved, if he wants it)

2.

3.

4.

5. KlueMaster

6. maurice

7. Auramyna

8.

BTW, wont Mr White be successfully saving a baddie only if the baddies tried to kill one of their own?

Edited September 20, 2011 by KlueMaster

[Molly Mae]

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. Plasmid (reserved, if he wants it)

2.

3.

4.

5. KlueMaster

6. maurice

7. Auramyna

8.

BTW, wont Mr White be successfully saving a baddie only if the baddies tried to kill one of their own?

There's a very narrow chance for Mr White to become bad, but there's a kill role in Mr Green. So if Mr Green tries to kill a baddie and Mr White saves the baddie, Mr White becomes bad. If Mr Green is bad from the beginning, Mr White will almost certainly never be bad--a good balance in case the baddies end up with Mr Green.

[Molly Mae]

I seriously typed this up in about 5-10 minutes. If you see anything odd, you can use this thread as discussion, as well.

I'm going back over it now.

[plasmid]

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. plasmid

2.

3.

4.

5. KlueMaster

6. maurice

7. Auramyna

8.

Is Mr. Green's killing role a RID kill, or does he just name the player or role to kill 'em?

Does Dr. White get added to BTSC if he miraculously turns undercover?

Also, I foresee confusion about the term "baddies" referring to cops and "goodies" being criminals.

At least, I plan to use that excuse if when I get tied up in my web of lies.

['Cat'astrophe]

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. plasmid

2.

3.

4. 'Cat'astrophe

5. KlueMaster

6. maurice

7. Auramyna

8.

Yay! Another mafia without vanillas!!

[Molly Mae]

Is Mr. Green's killing role a RID kill, or does he just name the player or role to kill 'em?

He kills by player name. I considered making him a RID kill, but figured it would likely be too hard for a goodie to RID a cop, since he would have to figure out both role and ID (instead of just ID).

Does Dr. White get added to BTSC if he miraculously turns undercover?

Yes.

Also, I foresee confusion about the term "baddies" referring to cops and "goodies" being criminals.

At least, I plan to use that excuse if when I get tied up in my web of lies.

Yeah, some people had that same problem in MaFBIa. In my line of work, though, it's easy to picture the cops as bad guys.

I'm actually kidding about that last bit. Cops are the chosen people.

I'm probably kidding about that last bit there, too. It's a quote from Fallen. <3

[araver]

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. plasmid

2.

3.

4. 'Cat'astrophe

5. KlueMaster

6. maurice

7. Auramyna

8. Araver

Follow the trail of bodies they said. Should be interesting. Especially since it's hosted by someone with multiple personalities (J/K, no mod-kill offense).

[Molly Mae]

We +1'd your post. =P

[MissKitten]

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. plasmid

2.

3. MiKi

4. 'Cat'astrophe

5. KlueMaster

6. maurice

7. Auramyna

8. Araver

Ah, what the heck, I'll join too.

Edited September 21, 2011 by MissKitten

[flamebirde]

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. plasmid

2. Flamebirde

3. MiKi

4. 'Cat'astrophe

5. KlueMaster

6. maurice

7. Auramyna

8. Araver

Looks good. Mafia content in my blood was getting low.

[Molly Mae]

Roles will go out tomorrow am in ~12 hours.

[Molly Mae]

Roles have been randomised and will go out shortly. N0 post might happen, depending on how busy work is.

This will be the game thread. In an attempt to preserve scum weekend on a day phase, N1 will end Friday night at ~8 pm Central Time.

[Molly Mae]

Roles are out. N1 ends Friday at 8 pm.

In your role PM, "a legitimate gangster" means that you are not a cop (in case you asked).

[Guest]

Mr White -- An old man, formerly a doctor of medicine. Cannot be bad. May save one target from the NK per night. If he successfully saves a baddie, he becomes bad.

Successfully saves means the target had to be targeted for a kill, correct?

[Molly Mae]

Mr White -- An old man, formerly a doctor of medicine. Cannot be bad. May save one target from the NK per night. If he successfully saves a baddie, he becomes bad.

Successfully saves means the target had to be targeted for a kill, correct?

Correct.

['Cat'astrophe]

Host: Yuli and Molly Mae

1. plasmid

2. Flamebirde

3. MiKi

4. 'Cat'astrophe ====> I feel so small

5. KlueMaster

6. maurice

7. Auramyna

8. Araver

Also...confirming

[MissKitten]

Wow... It's really quiet tonight....

[araver]

I know it's not Reservoir Dogs, but I'm still hearing the music (talking about "Love Grows Where My Rosemary Goes") ...

[plasmid]

Wow... It's really quiet tonight....

I'm about to fix that for sure!

Here's my analysis.

It seems like it would be very difficult to identify an undercover. The only real ways I can see doing it are: 1) an undercover targets Mr Brown and gets outed, or 2) an undercover carries out an action that is blatently something that only an undercover player would do and therefore gets their role outed by the boss or Mr Black. The undercovers can easily avoid either of these by simply not acting and just doing night kills. If the undercovers have abilities like spying or redirecting or blocking then they probably aren't all that useful anyway so they're not missing out on much by not acting.

Proposal 1:

Because of that, it seems to me like it would be useful to demand that people who can act at night do actually act (and therefore put themselves at risk of being detected by Mr Brown) and post some sort of evidence that they acted, or else get outed by the Boss and lynched. In fact, I might even go so far as to say that it might be all right to simply out all the roles that can act at night to force them to be accountable, mainly because no one except Mr Brown can identify factions and I honestly think that most of the night actions are sort of worthless if you not only don't know who the baddies are but also are working against baddies who can go undetected by simply not acting. The only drawback is that outing the roles that can act at night would help the undercovers identify Mr Brown by process of elimination and night kill him. I'll leave this open to discussion.

Proposal 2:

Taking proposal 1 to an extreme, the Boss might even consider just outing Mr Brown outright and demanding the doctor (who we know is not undercover) save him at night. Then everyone who can act on Mr Brown must do it and prove they did or else get lynched

Proposal 3:

I think we need Mr Green to kill every night (unless we identify the undercovers with proposal 2). Honestly, I'm pessimistic about us identifying the undercovers otherwise, so I think it makes sense to have Mr Green kill even if it's somewhat randomly because a blind lynch plus a blind Mr Green kill against a targeted undercover kill every day/night gives better odds for the mobsters than just a blind lynch against a targeted undercover kill every day/night. The argument against allowing Mr Green to kill is that, if he's undercover then the undercovers get two kills per night against one lynch a day, then the mobsters will die quickly and painfully.

The best way I can think of to allow Mr Green to kill without running the risk of an undercover Mr Green going on a rampage is that we vote every day on BOTH a person to lynch AND a person for Green to kill. If Mr Green disobeys orders, then he gets outed by the Boss and lynched the next day, and the person who he refused to kill was probably the other undercover.

Proposal 4:

Taking this one step further: if the Boss gets killed then there's nothing to stop Mr Green if he's undercover. Because of this, I think I would even go so far as to propose that Mr Green gets outed right away, in case the Boss dies early. We know that Dr White is a mobster, so he should save Mr Green from night kills because he would be a huge target (probably the most important target in the game). Unfortunately this would keep the doctor tied up, but would be the most reliable way I can imagine of giving the mobsters two daily kills against the undercover's night kill.

To break it down, here are my proposals:

1. The Boss outs everyone who can act at night in a way that can be proven, and insist that they post proof that they acted (to force the undercovers to run the risk of acting on Mr Brown)

2. Proposal #1, plus out Mr Brown, demand the doctor save him, and demand that everyone who can must act on him and post proof.

3. We vote on who Mr Green should kill every night. If Mr Green disobeys orders, then he and the person he didn't kill get lynched.

4. Proposal #3, plus the Boss outs Mr Green now (in case he's undercover and the Boss dies before he disobeys orders), and the doctor saves Green every night (if proposal #2 is done, then proposal #4 happens afterward).

But this is also my first mafia game, so feel free to point out logic holes or unintended consequences if my analysis seems off.

Then we need to decide which if any of these we want to implement.

You can vote if you want, but of course only the Boss's vote will actually count =)

Edit: and if Mr Green gets redirected, the Boss should out Boss' son and have him lynched

Edited September 23, 2011 by plasmid

[Guest]

Woah! Who invited that guy?

And I haven't even read his post yet.

[plasmid]

Yep, I'm definitely taking more of a "logicians wearing black or white hats" style approach than your usual Mafia approach.

[Molly Mae]

Yep, I'm definitely taking more of a "logicians wearing black or white hats" style approach than your usual Mafia approach.

Kind of off-topic, but....

@MM: Can we keep him? =P

[Guest]

Well, I have not checked the post for coherency of logic, but prima facie it will be like boss showing his hand to baddies undercovers (unless he is an undercover himself). What more would undercovers ask for on Night 1? Yeah, recruiting Mr White perhaps.

On a serious note though, it will be like removing a layer of protection around information. So, we will have all knowing majority v/s somewhat informed minority. We won't have to wait for information to reveal itself over the course of the game.