araver Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 Mystery Operation III We've barely started exploring our solar system when a message is received from outer space. It looks like an encoded operation is embedded in the message. And it also looks as it is a test of some sort. 4 *&* 8 = 6 20 *&* 5 = 12 8 *&* 31 = 34 ------------- 44 *&* 47 = ? Maybe we ought to respond to it? What do you think? P.S. General rules are the same as in and Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 curr3nt Posted January 11, 2011 Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) Started with prime - 1 83 *&* 13 = 94 --- (83-1) + (13-1) = 94 So went with N - ? for each number Started filling in the ones with prime numbers 20 *&* 5 = 12 --- (20-12) + (5-1) = 12 8 *&* 31 = 34 --- (8-4) + (31-1) = 34 80 *&* 31 = 62 --- (80-48) + (31-1) = 62 71 *&* 40 = 86 --- (71-1) + (40-24) = 86 50 *&* 11 = 30 --- (50-30) + (11-1) = 30 The ? shares some common denominators Except 15 *&* 2 = 9 --- (15-7?) + (2-1) = 9 Which I pretended wasn't there... Figured 22 *&* 12 = 14 --- (22-12) + (12-8) = 14 With what I had 44 *&* 47 = ? --- (44-?) + (47-1) = Guessed ? was 24 from 22 *&* 12 = 14 Making 44 *&* 47 = ? --- (44-24) + (47-1) = 66 Basically... not sure how it works. I'm just making things up. Edited because tabs do not work, neither do spaces... Edited January 11, 2011 by curr3nt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 Is this operation commutative? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 (edited) Is this operation commutative? That is a very quick question I'll answer it tomorrow when I add the daily example. Edited January 2, 2011 by araver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 I notice that only a few numbers on this chart are not divisible by four, is this... coincidence? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 I notice that only a few numbers on this chart are not divisible by four, is this... coincidence? Coincidence. Noted and I will add another example shortly... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 Daily example added. 4 *&* 8 = 6 20 *&* 5 = 12 8 *&* 31 = 34 15 *&* 2 = 9 ------------- 44 *&* 47 = ? And to answer Amanita's question: It is commutative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 If eight were the second number in any other group would the group end up with a result around six? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 If eight were the second number in any other group would the group end up with a result around six? Sorry, I can't really answer that as it looks like a shot in the dark. And please use spoilers. Adding another example to the challenge: 4 *&* 8 = 6 20 *&* 5 = 12 8 *&* 31 = 34 15 *&* 2 = 9 80 *&* 31 = 62 ------------- 44 *&* 47 = ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 You answered with your most recent post, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 Is the operation singular or multiple operations in a single item? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 (edited) Is the operation singular or multiple operations in a single item? I'm not sure I understand the question right as there is no example of "singular operation on a single item" for a binary operation I know of: - multiplication is basically one operand added multiple times (times the other operand) - exponentiation is basically one operand multiplied with itself multiple times (times the other operand) - addition is basically one operand increased by 1 (times the other operand) So, the mystery operation is a binary operation i.e. a function that takes two numbers and returns another number. Edited January 3, 2011 by araver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 ThanksTo clarify, I was asking if it performed several operations at once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2011 Adding another example to the challenge: 4 *&* 8 = 6 20 *&* 5 = 12 8 *&* 31 = 34 15 *&* 2 = 9 80 *&* 31 = 62 71 *&* 40 = 86 ------------- 44 *&* 47 = ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 4, 2011 Report Share Posted January 4, 2011 I'm still completely losing the solution of this puzzle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2011 4 *&* 8 = 6 20 *&* 5 = 12 8 *&* 31 = 34 15 *&* 2 = 9 80 *&* 31 = 62 71 *&* 40 = 86 83 *&* 13 = 94 ------------- 44 *&* 47 = ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 5, 2011 Report Share Posted January 5, 2011 Any particular reason that none of the numbers involved are negative? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2011 Any particular reason that none of the numbers involved are negative? Maybe. But I usually use non-negative integers in my Mystery Ops so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 5, 2011 Report Share Posted January 5, 2011 Maybe. But I usually use non-negative integers in my Mystery Ops so far. Okay, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2011 Okay, thanks. If you were asking if the operation can be applied on negative numbers as well, then ... it could. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 5, 2011 Report Share Posted January 5, 2011 This is an excellent puzzle araver, I usually pick patterns up quickly. I still can't find this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2011 Adding another example to the challenge: 4 *&* 8 = 6 20 *&* 5 = 12 8 *&* 31 = 34 15 *&* 2 = 9 80 *&* 31 = 62 71 *&* 40 = 86 83 *&* 13 = 94 50 *&* 11 = 30 ------------- 44 *&* 47 = ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 plainglazed Posted January 5, 2011 Report Share Posted January 5, 2011 Okay - maybe time for some group think. some thoughts in the following spoiler so if you dont care to see. strictly fwiw... every case except the first and including the case to solve contains a prime number. seems too much of a coincidence not to be relevant unless it's just meant to distract. have been playing with factors and combinations with no luck so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Guest Posted January 6, 2011 Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 I've been playing with this one as well, but I don't have a strong math background so most of the puzzles in this section elude me. My thoughts added to Plainglazed: I first tried experimenting with bases, but since the last puzzles were based related, I thought this would be different. I also noticed the primes and my "gut" feeling is that the solution is related to factoring. I factored all the problems and noticed a few patterns but nothing concrete. I think I just have not gone far enough with the math. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 araver Posted January 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 (edited) Adding another example: 4 *&* 8 = 6 20 *&* 5 = 12 8 *&* 31 = 34 15 *&* 2 = 9 80 *&* 31 = 62 71 *&* 40 = 86 83 *&* 13 = 94 50 *&* 11 = 30 40 *&* 42 = 28 ------------- 44 *&* 47 = ? And secretly enjoying that there there are at least three people thinking on this. But that's not a secret anymore since you opened the spoiler EDIT: Spelling Edited January 6, 2011 by araver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 plainglazed Posted January 6, 2011 Report Share Posted January 6, 2011 54? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Question
araver
Mystery Operation III
We've barely started exploring our solar system when a message is received from outer space.
It looks like an encoded operation is embedded in the message. And it also looks as it is a test of some sort.
Maybe we ought to respond to it?
What do you think?
P.S. General rules are the same as in and
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