[Guest]

Well I have yet to post in this forum, so this is my first...

I head this many years ago on a NZ radio station providing free legal advice to ring-ins and it kinda stuck with me ever since. Having no experience in legal matters, I will just recount what I remember.

MURDER, MANSLAUGHTER, or SUICIDE

A young man was depressed and decided to commit suicide by jumping off the top of a 12 storey building. After his leap, he would have taken only seconds before he hit the ground... instant death.

So... suicide right?

Not that easy. See, as he fell past the 9th floor, a random bullet flew through the window and hit him in the head, instantly killing him. He was already dead before he finished his fall.

So... murder? Well, we dont know that for sure. Perhaps at the most, accidental manslaughter (or a damn good marksman!)

Well, it turns out that on the 9th floor there is a married couple in the midst of a heated argument. The husband was threatening his wife with a gun, that he claims was unloaded, to get her to see his point of view. He didnt have intent to commit murder.

So... manslaughter? Assuming he really didnt know the gun was loaded.

However, the wife said she saw her son doing something with the gun just a day before. The thought was that he wanted a loan from his parents and since his mother said no, an extreme act of vengance was to load the gun he knew his father used to threaten his mother in the hopes of "topping her off".

So... is the son guilty of manslaughter? or murder? If person A has intent to kill person B and instead kills person C then that is still murder right? The son could be sitting at home half way across the city and suddenly gets arrested for murdering a falling guy shot in the head by a gun he loaded? Hmmm...

But then, what if the son, who was so annoyed that his mother didnt give him a loan, turned desperation into resignation and decided to jump off a 12 storey building to end it all, and was shot falling past the 9th floor....

Murder, manslaughter, or suicide?

[Guest]

Ive seen this before somewhere, i think it was in one of the 'darwin awards' books and it said that this was an anecdote used by the keynote speaker during a autopsy-persons convention (cant remember their professions name). the answer this version gave was:

since it was the son who loaded the gun with intent to kill/ do harm, it was deemed suicide as neither of the other participants could claim any sort of responsibility for the death, not knowing anything about the loading

[Guest]

Obviously it is suicide, because the kid was bound to die anyways. If the husband, say, put a spike outside the window and the kid jumped on it, it was the kids fault for even jumping off. If the manslauhgter kid made the husband put the spike outside the window, it still doesnt matter, because suicide kid was bound for death any way.

[Guest]

Obviously it is suicide, because the kid was bound to die anyways.

So... If I kill someone who is going to die anyway it wouldn't count as murder? I suppose that's the argument for euthanasia... and just because I'm going to die one day, it doesn't mean I'd be happy for someone to shoot me now. Or even a couple of seconds before I die of natural causes...

[onetruth]

Should this be in others? It is an interesting question, though.

Edit: Content

Edited August 19, 2008 by onetruth

[Guest]

So... If I kill someone who is going to die anyway it wouldn't count as murder? I suppose that's the argument for euthanasia... and just because I'm going to die one day, it doesn't mean I'd be happy for someone to shoot me now. Or even a couple of seconds before I die of natural causes...

Well, i hav to say, she(or he- sry i wuznt really paying attention to that) has a really good point. If murders where this smart( which, by the way, is impossible because itz not smart 2 kill) then there woludent be so many people in jail cuz theyed hav somthing to argue against and agrue with. i find this a very complicated stituation . i mean really, itz not even realilistic. <_< but if it were up to me, the kid is dead so thats that. the dad should be arrested for pointing the gun at his wife in the first place and the mom should just get a divorse.Why would you marry a guy who, A.only sees his way or the high way and B. who makes his point with a gun. The girl should have called 911 any wayz...

[Guest]

Well do we know that it was the kid that jumped because i recall you said it could be him? If so

It was suicide because he loaded the unloaded gun without anybody knowing.On the other hand the mother saw him do this and didnt say anything so she must have know that that it was her husbands gun so she wanted to commit suicide but her husband killed the boy so it was manslaughter.

Sorry about it being a tad 2 long

Edited November 6, 2008 by Chubbstick23

[Guest]

I inserted this into a spoiler so as not to ruin anyone's fun, but this is unfortunately an urban legend. See

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronald_Opus. We 'studied' this case in an early law class, for entertainment purposes. The correct (?) answer is that it would be ruled a suicide, although in real life other investigations resulting from this case would probably result in some other charges for different parties involved.

[Guest]

This is a more convoluted form of "Murder in the Desert" - posted on this site before....

[Guest]

simple answer: it is suicide because if you jump off a cliff, a building etc. you will die before you hit the ground becasue of the anticipation of death. He was dead before he got shot.

[andromeda]

I've heard this in the best detective television series EVER - "Homicide - Life on the Street".

The pathologist lady was telling a story of a guy... wait... I know the story so it wouldn't be fair for me to tell you. Figure it out yourselves!

[andromeda]

I inserted this into a spoiler so as not to ruin anyone's fun, but this is unfortunately an urban legend. See

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronald_Opus. We 'studied' this case in an early law class, for entertainment purposes. The correct (?) answer is that it would be ruled a suicide, although in real life other investigations resulting from this case would probably result in some other charges for different parties involved.

Hahaha... I just read it. That is exactly how they used the story in "Homicide" exactly! Good one!

[Guest]

spooky - I read this on the web today while looking for the empire state jumper survivor - freaky and cool