- New Logic/Math Puzzles - BrainDen.com

February 15, 2011

Critique, please.

Goodies: Passive mobs. WINCON: Must eliminate the hostiles.

Pig: Can push someone off of a cliff each night. (Kill).

Cow: Can make excessively loud noises, thus drawing its target away from any action. (Block).

Sheep: Can interfere with a kill, only being sheared. (Save).

Chicken: Chickens know everything. Don't believe me? Look up the chicken of destiny on youtube. (Spy).

Character: This guy has opposable thumbs. He counts, and can thus manipulate, the votes. (Vote redirect).

Squid: Minecraft's first underwater mob. With its insane cuteness, it can lure someone into a watery doom. (Trap.) There is a 50% chance of ice forming, trapping the target, and allowing the squid to investigate further. (Spy).

Slime: Wow. Slime can sure grow. He can carry over votes. So if he doesn't vote one day, he has an extra vote for future days which he can PM to me for later use.

Baddies: Hostile mobs. WINCON: Must be in the majority. Nightkill and BTSC

Creeper: If anyone gets too close to him, he explodes. Anyone who acts on him is blocked the next night. (Future block?)

Skeleton: Can hurt people from afar. As they cannot fight back, they must change course. (Redirect).

Zombie: Knows nothing of tactics. Can only follow a player. (Action spy)

Spider: Although ferocious at night, he is neutral during the day. At night, he may pick someone to chase, and manipulate their vote the following day. (Future vote redirect?)

Nether mobs: WINCON: Must kill two out of three secret targets. Has BTSC.

Ghast: A flying cuboid jellyfish that breathes fire. He can kill people, but only if his aim is perfect. (RID Kill).

Zombie Pigman: A neutral. He can change someone's vote each day. (Vote Manipulate).

Notch: WINCON: Must correctly RID one person from each faction. He is the Minecraft god, and can thus make his vote count up to three times in lynch. At night he can redirect an action, and try to RID one player.

araver · February 18, 2011

1) Well, at first glance, goodies mission is very very hard: Only 7 vs 4 vs 2 vs 1. Add to that the BTSC and the goodies are clearly outnumbered.

Also, even if there were 8 goodie, if eliminating hostiles means getting RID of all the indies it is still very hard. EDIT: Re-read and saw hostiles=Baddies (Hostile mob). 7 vs 7 still looks bad for goodies since no indy faction has any clear incentive to kill baddies or other indies.

2) Is there a difference between Vote Redirect-Chacter, Vote Manipulate - Zombie Pigman and Future-voteRedirect - Spider?

What happens if they both try to change/redirect the same person's vote? Also, I'm assuming that they change the vote, not the weight of the vote (e.g. Notch's vote will still count X3 if he chose so, even if it's redirected?)

3) I like the future block ability. What happens if multiple people target him? Do they all get blocked for the next night? Does the night-post show who will be blocked (either player names or roles)?

4) I understand Notch's targets are secret and RID = RID Guess. Is the RID Guess shown in the night-post? Even if it fails?

EDIT: And what happens if for example both Indies die before Notch can RID them? (assuming he can't RID lynched people.

5) I see some actions clashing against each other, mostly because of (multiple) redirects.

But it largely depends on the order of actions or precedence of actions. Can you put one up?

Thanks.

Edited February 18, 2011 by araver

February 18, 2011

1) Well, at first glance, goodies mission is very very hard: Only 7 vs 4 vs 2 vs 1. Add to that the BTSC and the goodies are clearly outnumbered.
Point taken.

Also, even if there were 8 goodie, if eliminating hostiles means getting RID of all the indies it is still very hard. EDIT: Re-read and saw hostiles=Baddies (Hostile mob). 7 vs 7 still looks bad for goodies since no indy faction has any clear incentive to kill baddies or other indies.
Again, point taken.

2) Is there a difference between Vote Redirect-Chacter, Vote Manipulate - Zombie Pigman and Future-voteRedirect - Spider?
What happens if they both try to change/redirect the same person's vote? Also, I'm assuming that they change the vote, not the weight of the vote (e.g. Notch's vote will still count X3 if he chose so, even if it's redirected?)
There is no difference between Pigman and Character, but Spider has to chose who he will redirect the previous night. Notch's vote still counts multiple times even if he is redirected. I haven't quite decided which manipulation takes precedence over others.

3) I like the future block ability. What happens if multiple people target him? Do they all get blocked for the next night? Does the night-post show who will be blocked (either player names or roles)?
The night post will signify Creeper's action taking place. Apart from that, it is up to logic to figure out who was blocked.

4) I understand Notch's targets are secret and RID = RID Guess. Is the RID Guess shown in the night-post? Even if it fails?
EDIT: And what happens if for example both Indies die before Notch can RID them? (assuming he can't RID lynched people.
The RID is not shown in the post. And RID applies to all players. Not just living ones.

5) I see some actions clashing against each other, mostly because of (multiple) redirects.
But it largely depends on the order of actions or precedence of actions. Can you put one up?
I will put one up momentarily.

Thanks.

akaslickster · February 19, 2011

1. Slick

2.

3.

4.

araver · February 20, 2011

@Slick - I think this will be on after

February 21, 2011

Order of actions:

RID >Future Block> Block> Redirect >Trap >Save >RID Kill >Kill >Spy >Future vote manipulate> Vote manipulate

araver · February 21, 2011

Order of actions:

RID >Future Block> Block> Redirect >Trap >Save >RID Kill >Kill >Spy >Future vote manipulate> Vote manipulate

OK, this is fine, but it adds a slight advantage to the Baddie faction: the fact that only baddies have a redirect, makes the baddie redirect + baddie Future Block an advantage over goodie trap, save and kill.

If you plan to add 1 person with a strong ability to goodies, it should balance somehow.

- Either a role that has a die-roll choice of abilities (which could give an extra goodie kill at some point).

- Or make a goodie invulnerable at night, till another one does.

Thanks.

February 21, 2011

OK, this is fine, but it adds a slight advantage to the Baddie faction: the fact that only baddies have a redirect, makes the baddie redirect + baddie Future Block an advantage over goodie trap, save and kill.
If you plan to add 1 person with a strong ability to goodies, it should balance somehow.
- Either a role that has a die-roll choice of abilities (which could give an extra goodie kill at some point).
- Or make a goodie invulnerable at night, till another one does.

Thanks.

Hmm. I'm temped to make Notch a goodie with a roll die action (1-kill, 2-save, 3-block, 4-redirect, 5-vote manipulate, 6-choose) and make Herobrine an independent in Notch's place, with the same die-roll abilities, plus an RID each night.

araver · February 21, 2011

Hmm. I'm temped to make Notch a goodie with a roll die action (1-kill, 2-save, 3-block, 4-redirect, 5-vote manipulate, 6-choose) and make Herobrine an independent in Notch's place, with the same die-roll abilities, plus an RID each night.

So 8 goodies vs 4 baddies vs 2 indies vs 1 indy... might work.

Notch could choose a kill so an extra vote and extra 33% kill can definitely improve goodies chances overall.

Just to clarify the last indy, you mean without the 3xvote ?

Herobrine: WINCON: Must correctly RID one person from each faction. Each night has a roll die action (1-kill, 2-save, 3-block, 4-redirect, 5-vote manipulate, 6-choose and can try to RID one player.

Edited February 21, 2011 by araver

peace*out · February 22, 2011

1. Slick Peace
2. Slick
3.
4.

ok: my ideas...if you add notch, maybe have it be learning X each night, or can send a message to a role each night (remember - from creating the game, notch is basically omnipresent).

Im not good at suggesting changes, but if you DO change things (not saying you should/n't) a couple ideas:
Skeleton: they ARE REALLY HARD to sneak up on, so maybe, if you learn the role, he learns yours, or if you target him 2 nights in a row, something happens??? then again, the baddies already seems to have a lot of strength...meh.

for the creeper: maybe (even though the baddies are stong, these are jsut my thoughts and stuff) since they "take out the ground underneath you," they somehow affect who their target is targeting?

I like the chicken's role...especially since they are ninjas...

[spoiler=if you need another faction or whatever.. ]Also: if you need to get rid of a group/add something, LAVA and WATER are also very big parts of the game. lava sets you on fire (lasting something?) and destroys your stuff immediately (???) and water...it can carry you into lava, however, you can also go UP a waterfall to get back to where you were...so it can effect it's faction

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March 1, 2011

Peace, you make a good point about Lava and Water. Here's my new idea. If it still isn't balanced, I'll take out Lava and Water.