araver

Did not see this when I posted. But what I said to darth nox still stands. You just claimed Notch (there is no other way to interpret the last line). You are wrong a little in that proposed strategy. About identifying Character - we need not do that. Plus Character has no gaining info-knowledge and would not know much about EDM (unless EDM is Character, in which case why would Zombie Pigman rescue her?). I'm slightly confused. Again, from Role Descriptions, from all the goodies, Slime is the only one who should abstain, if the other goodies provide enough vote pressure on someone. You leaving your vote blank helps no one IMHO.

I don't think that's what he asked Hint: He is most probably referring to a certain action in N1. Slightly off-topic: And hinting about your role when there is only one possibility = claiming. It's not bad in this game/now since most dangerous roles (RID Kill, RID guess, redirect) are gone. But you need to remember this in future games ... if anyone (with no previous knowledge via their own abilities) can narrow your hint to a single role, then you are actually outing yourself I would have slight meta-gaming issues in believing you (or call it hunches as others do), but I will believe you for now. You claiming something when others aren't is good enough for me. @Molly - so we move to Shadow7, then?

Clarification needed: If Skeleton (or Notch) redirects someone with no night action (e.g. Slime), is that shown in the night-post? Or considered successful?.

I can add very little to that. But with this ring of trust initiated by MM, I can refine the spreadsheet even further. 1) EDM voted for Framm in D1 and maurice in D2. No one acted on her so there's no way to infer if she is Creeper and blocked anyone the following night. She does not sound baddie (e.g. voting for Framm in D1 with both Framm and say baddies). She does not sound like she wants to get lynch either. *shrug* She looks like either Zombie Pigman (most likely) or Notch. So even if she may be a safe (non-Liquid) lynch, she most probably won't get us closer to eliminating the Hostiles. 2) Cow blocked Hirkala in N1 then did not appear. Night 3 post showed me that Hirk is Lava not Creeper, so my initial impression that Cow acted on Creeper in N1 and was blocked in N2due to Creeper's ability was wrong. Since Cow did not make an appearance in N2 or N3, then Solman was most likely Cow. (but, objectively, Solman could have been Slime, Character or Water since none of these appeared in the following posts). 3)So, if we have Pig, Cow, Sheep, Chicken, Character, Slime accounted for, that only leaves Squid and Notch. Along with Creeper, Zombie, Zombie Pigman and Water. Leaving 5 unknowns alive: maurice, EDM, Marq, Shadow and darthnox and 1 dead (curr3nt). From the night-posts and Creeper's passive ability, I can't clear any of them because they have not been acted upon. Also, Zombie does not appear in N3 post. It could have been curr3nt, but no way to be sure. 4) I also may have found a loophole in one of my reasonings *scratch* Skeleton does not appear in N2. We know who Skeleton was, he was not blocked, he could have been powerplayed (no reason to not act), no one was blocked that night. And the most likely redirect (Skeleton redirecting Abhisk/Herobrine) was not shown either. I thought (and still think) this means Skeleton acted on someone with no night-action. If Skeleton (or Notch) redirects someone with no action, is that shown in the night-post? Or considered successful?. 'Cause if this is the case, I have some trouble with the "Notch redirected Vine".

@Molly - Thanks. I missed that. I thought everything in that post was WIFOM. Voting for a non-goodie, worst case, may lead us to lynching Water which would fulfill the Liquid WinCon. I don't see EDM as Water, though. Fingers crossed. Fixing the colors Server Owner: Blablah 1) Vineetrika - voting for EDM 3) Slick - voting for araver 4) Araver - Voting for EDM 9) GMaster479 - voting for araver 10) maurice - Trapped: Cannot vote or post. 11) EDM - voting for Molly Mae 13) Marq - Voting for EDM 14) Shadow 15) darth nox - Voting for EDM 17) Molly Mae - voting for EDM DEAD: 2) Peace - Dead: Banned and found to be Ghast 5) Hirkala - Dead: Solidified by Herobrine and found to be Lava 6) Framm - Dead: Respawned at a remote location and found to be Spider 7) Abhisk - Dead: Drowned in obsidian formed by Lava and found to be Herobrine 8) solman - Dead: Exploded by Creeper 12) curr3nt - Dead: Pushed off of a cliff by Pig 16) sayalzah - Dead: Burnt in Lava and found to be Skeleton

Defend a bit what? I've already told you who I am and what I did - Sheep - saved myself for three nights in a row (albeit the first one I was redirected by Skeleton but most probably to self). And I told you that with 1 vote on me!!!!!! With Herobrine and Skeleton out, and the RID Killer gone, I have absolutely no reason to keep my role a secret. As long as Notch understands and does not block/redirect me, I can stay alive at night. Or save another goodie if needed. I was fearful so far of redirects (Skeleton and Herobrine-die or Notch-die). I do not have any more information (ability-wise). I have never been spied by Chicken or Squid so I can't be cleared by any of them. Any info I gleaned from the night-posts I shared every day. Every suspicion I have (from voting/posts) was stated. Day 1 - I thought pressure could make those blocked more easy to share info. I said to all ties are bad. I bandwagonned on Peace, getting her lynched. Day 2 - I said either Framm or Say is bad. I continued to pressure people around, started getting Framm lynched. This is Day 3 and only GM and maurice are alive on my list of suspects. And I don't have any info on their roles, just hunches reading their posts and votes, corroborated to them not being shown in certain night-posts. All I have are pretty certain goodies: - I'm pretty certain who Herobrine RID Guessed as Slime on Day 1 (as sayalzah was revealed to be Skeleton) and will trust/save Vineetrika because of that reason. - I was fairly certain (and I stated) that either Slick or Molly or GM or Hirkala was Chicken (since Chicken did not appear in N1 post and those 4 were blocked/trapped). Hirkala being Lava means only 3 possibilities remain, all alive now. - I was sure Abhisk was lying, him being Herobrine (with a self-save) was the only thing that made sense. Hence I did not try to save him and I hoped Pig would take him out. Lava's double kill was perfect (although Hirkala's comment during N3 was too obvious, IMHO, no goodie with a deathwish does not sound like that). - I don't know why Pig killed curr3nt. I pegged curr3nt as either a goodie letting me do the grunt work or as an Indy who is not dangerous (as Herobrine was). - Molly's comment to Slick, if truthful, suggests he *knows* Slick's role, which means he is either Chicken or Squid. Either make sense from what I read in the N1 post (either Squid self-trap himself or Squid trapped Chicken N1). Hence I believe Molly (since no one claimed/counterclaimed him). If he trusts Slick for real (not WIFOM), that marks another teammate for me. Again, Squid, Chicken, lead the way. Give me someone to vote for. I'm blind here.

Until I hear otherwise from Molly ... and as I suspect last night Pig inadvertently killed the goodie that could give me more info. Server Owner: Blablah 1) Vineetrika 2) Peace - Dead: Banned and found to be Ghast 3) Slick - voting for araver 4) Araver - voting for GMaster 5) Hirkala - Dead: Solidified by Herobrine and found to be Lava 6) Framm - Dead: Respawned at a remote location and found to be Spider 7) Abhisk - Dead: Drowned in obsidian formed by Lava and found to be Herobrine 8) solman - Dead: Exploded by Creeper 9) GMaster479 - voting for araver 10) maurice - Trapped: Cannot vote or post. 11) EDM 12) curr3nt - Dead: Pushed off of a cliff by Pig 13) Marq 14) Shadow 15) darth nox 16) sayalzah - Dead: Burnt in Lava and found to be Skeleton 17) Molly Mae -voting for araver

@GM & Slick - are you like 10-year old or something???? Bandwagoning without even bothering to read what I said? I'm aware no one spied on me, but no one counter-claimed me either. I was most probably redirected to self in N1 and not-bothered in N2 and N3: Night 1 Night 2 Night 3

@Molly - you being trapped in N1, then a certain role being active in N2 and N3 makes me trust you (almost completely). Your comment about Slick is clear. But you are not commenting on GM. Is he to be avoided in a lynch? (Water)

With Skeleton and Herobrine out of the picture, I do not fear redirects at nights. I am SHEEP. And I have been shamelessly saving myself till now. I do not know who to vote for. My only suspect is trapped. Have no info on anyone. Squid, Chicken, tell me who to vote.

@abhisk - Thank you. That is what I half-expected to hear.

@BlaBlah - Thank you for all the answers. Much appreciated. @Abhisk - my remarks to you in are still valid. Even more since Framm was revealed a baddie. I really think you can stay alive AND help your faction by sharing some info.

I voted for you because you don't defend UNLESS there are votes on you. Baddie tactic is valid, I give you that. But another tactic is being a baddie and WIFOM-ing about such a tactic. Neither clears anything. Neither you nor EDM have appeared in the night-posts. So no one (Chicken, Squid) has any info on you. Had they gotten a read on you, trust me, I would not be having this conversation out in the open. Days are meant to complement night-time info gathering. As for what you said about baddies having a headstart ... they have, as I pointed out they knew/almost knew who Abhisk is and tried to kill him for it. And if Framm is revealed to being a baddie, I don't see why Abhisk can't level the ground and narrow to the rest who he is. Herobrine already had a Goodie RID guessed, the other indies (Zombie Pigman left) can only profit from his outing if he is on their list AND gets killed or lynched. Which, with combined goodie help during the day and night, won't happen.

Really, you're bringing up the two games in which you were the Indy????? Again, in this game, you don't put anything on the table, deflecting any vote on you as not being a suspicion that "deserves" to be addressed. Gut feelings have lynched in the past, goodies, baddies and indies, no discriminations. You have 3 votes on you ... start talking. Say something about yourself. Anything which is not obvious (you are not Ghast, nor Zombie Pigman, that's the only obvious info I have on you). Framm cleared himself from being Water (in my opinion) because no host will let someone with a "get lynched" wincon pull a "no contest". Which is why I still want BlaBlah to make an appearance and tell us if he accepts the no contest or not. PS: Thanks for using hokum. I learned a word I did not know and I appreciate you using the euphemism.

Yes, again, that is not unambiguous for me until I see who Framm was. His vote (which was not a very good self-defense) can be anything depending on who Framm was (last minute info/defense, last minute frame, lastminute-reverse-frame-of-a-teammate, etc).

Hmm, you just opened a big can of WIFOM for me. I don't want to eat from that. But to reciprocate: My favorite suspicions/theory on who Herobrine is were mentioned before (RID Guess Slime was not lucky which means Herobrine and Slime are the two players who did vote on D1 - Vineetrika and Sayalzah). And your condition is simple. If Herobrine's save was a mistake/frame/whatever, it won't come the next night. To earn a save, you need to be prepared to be killed. Sheep was alive last night and if not lynched today, you'd probably get a sure save. But bottom line is that I can't trust anything you say until BlaBlah says if he accepts No Contest and we get to know who Framm is.

I did not try to use your vote on Peace as a condemning offense alone. At the moment when I changed my vote to you, Framm had not pulled a "No contest" which means the lynch could have got away from him (at least in my opinion). If someone would push for something like that. Which is what I asked you about: Look at it from my POV: someone I did not clear for being in the same faction with Framm (along with Slick, because of the vote yesterday) tries to launch WIFOM arguments like "Framm may be Water. Maybe we shouldn't all bandwagon him". Which you know as well I do that will scare any newbie away from voting Framm. On a more general note, I don't like how you don't give any info whatsoever, no matter who votes for you. I can't ignore, as much as I would try to, the fact that when you are not a goodie, you don't say anything of importance unless someone really forces into claiming something. Gut feelings towards people you know = severe metagaming. Call it that. Give me something to work with. @abhisk - I'm probably not seeing what you see. I only see Framm's initial defense stating he has no info to "save himself" (instead of "clear himself"?). In D2, I see only GM suspiciously bandwagonning with no reason, missing how many people actually know his role (which was partially cleared by maurice I think) AND then missing the fact that Zombie can only follow a player (Action spy), not learn his role. I also saw an explanation for Framm's "slip" on D1 from sayalzah:

Doubtful. "Zombie Pigman: A neutral. He can change someone's vote each day. (Vote Manipulate)." Again, hypothetically, if I were ZP and wanted to save Peace, I would not vote - Peace. I would vote for another one close (e.g. Framm) + vote manipulate another one voting for Peace into voting for Framm. Bottom line 1 vote from Peace goes behind the scenes to Framm and my public vote on Framm . This is optimal any way you look at it.

@Abhisk - baddies followed you in N1 (action spy) and saw who you targetted, then immediately tried to kill you. You are most likely Herobrine, Notch or Squid. Herobrine saving you in N2 adds a lot towards what Framm just said ... that you are likely Herobrine. Either way, it's unlikely you can get saved yourself. So, anything you wish to share with us? Or do you want the baddies to try to kill you in N3?

@maurice - I think you are wrong about ZP. I automatically excluded the following after D1 as being Zombie Pigman. 3) Slick - voting for Peace 4) Araver - Voting for Peace 10) maurice - voting for Peace 6) Framm - Voting for Peace 7) Abhisk - Voting for Araver 9) GMaster479 - voting for Marq 15) darth nox - voting for Marq Any sane ZP would vote for Framm or Say in order to not lynch the important RID Kill. And if Framm were the ZP, he would not vote Peace, he would vote Say. Too close a lynch to do crazy stunts, plenty of suspects (Framm, Say) to move your vote to.

Missed a vote. Server Owner: Blablah 1) Vineetrika - voting for Sayalzah 2) Peace - Dead: Banned and found to be Ghast 3) Slick - Trapped. Cannot vote or post. 4) Araver - voting for maurice 5) Hirkala 6) Framm - Voting for Hirkala 7) Abhisk 8) solman - Dead: Killed by Creeper 9) GMaster479 - voting for Framm 10) maurice - voting for Sayalzah 11) EDM - voting for maurice 12) curr3nt - voting for Framm 13) Marq 14) Shadow - voting for maurice 15) darth nox - voting for Framm 16) sayalzah - voting for Framm 17) Molly Mae

@Shadow7 - you are flip-flopping without saying much. Say, Framm then maurice. Any reason or do you have BTSC buddies advising you? @darth nox - you basically voted twice, with no explanation whatsoever. What's up? Care to say something with your votes? Care to contribute? @Vineetrika - you started this vote on say today. I pegged you and sayalzah as possible Slime because both of you did not vote on D1 and Herobrine RID Guessed Slime (so he either flipped.) Are you claiming Slime? Cause the most likely way I see it, one of you is Slime and the other is Herobrine! @Framm - a goodie usually defends with 6 votes on him or at least gives other goodies information. Framm, you are definitely not good. But IMO, you are food for the night, not the day. @maurice - You're not really helpful. You're WIFOM trying to save Framm right now after you voted for Peace yesterday too. Given how many newbies are in this game, it's hard to tell, but I think you're expecting another veteran player to jump in and get votes off of Framm. Especially with no defense. So DEFEND. Server Owner: Blablah 1) Vineetrika - voting for Sayalzah 2) Peace - Dead: Banned and found to be Ghast 3) Slick - Trapped. Cannot vote or post. 4) Araver - voting for maurice 5) Hirkala 6) Framm - Voting for Hirkala 7) Abhisk 8) solman - Dead: Killed by Creeper 9) GMaster479 - voting for Framm 10) maurice - voting for Sayalzah 11) EDM - voting for maurice 12) curr3nt - voting for Framm 13) Marq 14) Shadow - voting for Framm 15) darth nox - voting for Framm 16) sayalzah - voting for Framm 17) Molly Mae

@curr3nt - No, I probably did not figure out what you say. I am still waiting on a lot of answers from Blablah. And there are more last night that went unanswered: and the questions in this post

Well, now that you're alive, you should say something.

What I see from the night-post is: Herobrine RID guess Slime correctly Squid trapped Slick and spied him. Herobrine rolled a 2-Save. Sheep saved the wrong person. Zombie killed Abhisk Zombie followed GM Chicken spied GM Herobrine RID Guesses a Goodie. Which brings the question: Herobrine: WINCON: Must correctly RID one person from each faction. Faction=all other 4 factions: Goodies, Baddies, Nether, Liquids? If 4, it's still good. If only 2 then it's looking grim. Can Herobrine RID Guess on killed / dead people? If Herobrine completes his WinCon, does the game stop? Hmm, both Notch and Cow were not shown. Either they are dead (Abhisk, Solman), or inactive (voluntary or not) or are active but were passively blocked because they targeted the Creeper in Night 1. Let's see, Notch blocked GM, Cow blocked Hirkala. Since baddies followed GM this night, more likely to be Creeper is Hirkala. Problem is the Creeper killed in N1, and kills can be blocked so this clears all blocked/trapped in N1 from being the Creeper. Which leaves as likely the very bad situation that both Cow and Notch are dead. Which again is a slight contradiction since they were shown N1 and not N2 and kills could have not blocked them. So either inactives, or most likely assumption Cow was Solman and Notch rolled a kill or vote manipulation in N2. Also, Skeleton was not shown. Which makes me think either Slick=Skeleton or the baddies chose not to redirect (less likely). But Slick =Skeleton contradicts the N1 post since Herobrine blocked Slick and Skeleton acted. Maybe I still got the OOA wrong: If Herobrine blocks Skeleton, would Skeleton's redirect go through? (block>redirect) Unfortunately, we can't do something about that today. Squid knows for sure who Slick is (ice forming=spy successful from RD). Also, a little confused about something else. I'm assuming due to order of actions and BlaBlah's clarification on what ">" means, but need to be sure: Kills are not-blocking, right? If a person has an action from those that are "> kill", they still get to do it, right? Lava Kill >RID Guess >Future Block> Block> Redirect >Trap >Save >RID Kill >Kill So, we return to today's voting and what Abhisk and later Vine said. Baddies switched a vote to get Peace lynched, despite her teammate influence. Which means it's very likely one of them was in the lynch. And Herobrine's "lucky" guess clears someone in my opinion. Leaving ... Framm Server Owner: Blablah 1) Vineetrika 2) Peace - Dead: Banned and found to be Ghast 3) Slick - Trapped. Cannot vote or post. 4) Araver - voting for Framm 5) Hirkala 6) Framm 7) Abhisk - Dead: Killed by Zombie 8) solman - Dead: Killed by Creeper 9) GMaster479 10) maurice 11) EDM 12) curr3nt 13) Marq 14) Shadow 15) darth nox 16) sayalzah 17) Molly Mae