Jump to content


Welcome to BrainDen.com - Brain Teasers Forum

Welcome to BrainDen.com - Brain Teasers Forum. Like most online communities you must register to post in our community, but don't worry this is a simple free process. To be a part of BrainDen Forums you may create a new account or sign in if you already have an account.
As a member you could start new topics, reply to others, subscribe to topics/forums to get automatic updates, get your own profile and make new friends.

Of course, you can also enjoy our collection of amazing optical illusions and cool math games.

If you like our site, you may support us by simply clicking Google "+1" or Facebook "Like" buttons at the top.
If you have a website, we would appreciate a little link to BrainDen.

Thanks and enjoy the Den :-)
Guest Message by DevFuse
 

Photo
- - - - -


  • Please log in to reply
353 replies to this topic

#1 CuteSparklezGirl

CuteSparklezGirl

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 976 posts

Posted 03 March 2009 - 05:32 AM

It seems there is a lot of controversy over this topic on Brainden.... Understandable... Well I just mean spiritual as in God but also as in ghosts and things. What is your opinion?
  • 0

#2 Atlantis

Atlantis

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 344 posts

Posted 03 March 2009 - 07:08 AM

I believe in a higher power, ghosts(misguided spirits), reincarnation...also 'mythical' creatures...*rides away on pet dragon*...
  • 0

#3 RainThinker

RainThinker

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 706 posts

Posted 03 March 2009 - 07:33 AM

This is almost a fusion of 2 threads already posted here, the religion, and supernatural (not the mafia game) discussions... but here's what I believe:
I do not believe in God.
I do believe in the supernatural; ghosts and reincarnation mostly.
Although the only mythical creature I believe might exist is the Chupacabra
  • 0

#4 Atlantis

Atlantis

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 344 posts

Posted 03 March 2009 - 07:35 AM

This is almost a fusion of 2 threads already posted here, the religion, and supernatural (not the mafia game) discussions... but here's what I believe:
I do not believe in God.
I do believe in the supernatural; ghosts and reincarnation mostly.
Although the only mythical creature I believe might exist is the Chupacabra


*Atlantis' dragon eats Rain's Chupacabra*
sorry :unsure:
  • 0

#5 unreality

unreality

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 6370 posts

Posted 03 March 2009 - 09:17 PM

same as RainThinker. Ixnay on all the spirits, ghosts, banshees, leprechauns, unicorns, gods and other mythical creatures ;D
  • 0

#6 IDoNotExist

IDoNotExist

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1304 posts

Posted 03 March 2009 - 10:01 PM

I believe in a higher power, ghosts(misguided spirits), reincarnation...also 'mythical' creatures...*rides away on pet dragon*...


Reincarnation? As another human being or as anything? You would really have to do alot of explaining for me to understand that one.
  • 0

#7 CuteSparklezGirl

CuteSparklezGirl

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 976 posts

Posted 03 March 2009 - 11:09 PM

If the supernatural is obvious... Why not God?
  • 0

#8 CuteSparklezGirl

CuteSparklezGirl

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 976 posts

Posted 03 March 2009 - 11:10 PM

f of God - Intelligent Design
What would constitute objective proof of God? Well, consider the following self-evident and universally recognized truth: Concept and design necessitate an intelligent designer. The presence of intelligent design proves the existence of an intelligent designer. It's simply cause and effect. In our search for proof of God's existence, we could examine the various claims of supernatural occurrences, determine whether or not these are legitimate experiences, and build a case for the existence of the supernatural, which would be a step towards identifying a supernatural Creator God. Or we can just apply what we already know and search for signs of intelligent design within creation itself.

We know that design necessitates a designer. In fact, in accordance with this fundamental axiom, design detection methodology is a prerequisite in many fields of human endeavor, including archaeology, anthropology, forensics, criminal jurisprudence, copyright law, patent law, reverse engineering, crypto analysis, random number generation, and SETI. And how do we recognize intelligent design? In general, we find "specified complexity" to be a reliable indicator of the presence of intelligent design. Chance can explain complexity alone but not specification -- a random sequence of letters is complex but not specified (it's meaningless). A Shakespearean sonnet is both complex and specified (it's meaningful). We can't have a Shakespearean sonnet without Shakespeare. (William A. Dembski, The Design Inference: Eliminating Chance through Small Probabilities, 1998.)

Proof of God - Nature
So where's the proof of God's existence? In accordance with our familiar axiom and in light of the tremendous advances we've made in molecular biology, biochemistry, genetics and information theory, the proof of God is all around us!

Through the microscope, we observe the E. coli bacterial flagellum. The bacterial flagellum is what propels E. coli bacteria through its microscopic world. It consists of about 40 individual protein parts including a stator, rotor, drive-shaft, U-joint, and propeller. It's a microscopic outboard motor! The individual parts come into focus when magnified 50,000 times (using electron micrographs). And even though these microscopic outboard motors run at an incredible 100,000 rpm, they can stop on a microscopic dime. It takes only a quarter turn for them to stop, shift directions and start spinning 100,000 rpm in the opposite direction! The flagellar motor has two gears (forward and reverse), is water-cooled, and is hardwired into a signal transduction (sensory mechanism) so that it receives feedback from its environment. ("Unlocking the Mystery of Life," video documentary by Illustra Media, 2002.)

When we apply the general principles of detecting specified complexity to biologic systems (living creatures), we find it reasonable to infer the presence intelligent design. Take, for example, the bacterial flagellum's stator, rotor, drive-shaft, U-joint, and propeller. It is not convenient that we've given these parts these names - that's truly their function. If you were to find a stator, rotor, drive-shaft, U-joint, or propeller in any vehicle, machine, toy or model, you would recognize them as the product of an intelligent source. No one would expect an outboard motor -- much less one as incredible as the flagellar motor -- to be the product of a chance assemblage of parts. Motors are the product of intelligent design.

Furthermore, the E. coli bacterial flagellum simply could not have evolved gradually over time. The bacterial flagellum is an "irreducibly complex" system. An irreducibly complex system is one composed of multiple parts, all of which are necessary for the system to function. If you remove any one part, the entire system will fail to function. Every individual part is integral. There is absolutely no naturalistic, gradual, evolutionary explanation for the bacterial flagellum. (Michael Behe, Darwin's Black Box, 1996.)

The bacterial flagellum (not to mention the irreducibly complex molecular machines responsible for the flagellum's assembly) is just one example of the specified complexity that pervades the microscopic biological world. Molecular biologist Michael Denton wrote, "Although the tiniest bacterial cells are incredibly small, weighing less than 10-12 grams, each is in effect a veritable micro-miniaturized factory containing thousands of exquisitely designed pieces of intricate molecular machinery, made up altogether of one hundred thousand million atoms, far more complicated than any machinery built by man and absolutely without parallel in the non-living world." (Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis, 1986, p. 250.)

Proof of God - His Fingerprints are Everywhere
Where is the proof of God? If we're willing to open our eyes, we'll see the fingerprints of God all around us and all throughout us. Our very existence proves the existence of a Creator God.
Is there any scientific proof of God?

Before we can discuss the existence of scientific proof of God, we need to identify what we mean by proof. Also, to know what type of evidence supporting the existence of God would be considered by science, we also need to know which definition of science applies.

The definition of science has changed within the last century from an overall search for truth to a more limited scope of natural explanations of natural processes. Using the current narrow scope definition, there is not any scientific proof of God. The truth or untruth of this statement is not based upon evidence or lack of evidence, but by definition alone. Even though there is extensive, solid evidence for God’ s existence, none of that evidence would be admissible in the science court of law using the current definition.

Consequently, to know what evidence really supports the existence of God, we need to base our statements on the old classic definition of science to eliminate the disqualification of the evidence. The kind of evidence we need to consider is the same type that would be admissible in a court of law.

The level of proof is different in a criminal court than a civil court. In a civil court the prosecution only needs to prove that the preponderance of evidence tips the scales in their direction. Alternatively, in a criminal court a higher level of proof is required. The prosecutor needs to provide evidence that proves the defendant is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

What types of evidence are admissible in courtrooms? These include direct evidence such as fingerprints, DNA, or eyewitness accounts. Also, circumstantial evidence is normally admissible unless it is abnormally weak. Although circumstantial evidence is indirect, it can be powerful evidence to prove guilt or innocence.



Scientific Proof of God – The Evidence
What evidence exists that could prove the existence or non-existence of God? Does God exist?

First, the non-existence of God cannot be proven. One cannot prove a universal negative. Alternatively, the existence of God is provable.


The concept, design, and intricate details of our world necessitate an intelligent designer.


Both direct and indirect evidence for God’s existence are well known and well documented. Nothing in history is better known or better documented than the birth, life, death, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. We even use the year of His birth as the basis for our calendar. He perfectly matched the over 100 unique Messianic prophecies in the Old Testament regarding His birth, life, death, and resurrection. The laws of probability cannot give us a reasonable explanation for either the Messianic predictions or the resurrection, let alone both by the same person.

Jesus’ miracles were witnessed by many and were documented redundantly for additional corroboration. He was seen by at least 500 people after His resurrection. He was seen ascending into heaven. His transfiguration was seen by Peter, James, and John. His wisdom in dealing with many circumstances was astounding. He never promoted Himself or His miracles. C. S. Lewis stated that He couldn’t have just been a good teacher. He was either a liar, lunatic, or Lord. He didn’t even come close to meeting the profile of a liar or lunatic, so He had to be God.


Jesus Christ also supported the truth of the Old Testament and quoted it many times. Consequently, with Jesus Christ, we have an eyewitness to the truth of the Old Testament. This gives credibility to the creation account and God’s interaction with man. The entire Old Testament account is about how God is trying to have a relationship with man while man is separating himself from God by sin. It tells how God is long-suffering and merciful and ultimately how God sent His Son to die for our sins so God could ultimately have a relationship with us.

God’s interaction with man in the Old Testament was often and powerful. Some of the main interactions included Adam, Cain, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Jacob, Moses, Joshua, the Israelites, the prophets, and the kings. In addition to Jesus’ testimony to the truth of the Old Testament, ancient manuscripts, archaeology, and internal consistency also testify to its truth. Consequently, much direct evidence including eyewitness accounts and indirect evidence corroborate the existence of God and the truth of the Bible.

Edited by CuteSparklezGirl, 03 March 2009 - 11:11 PM.

  • 0

#9 Izzy

Izzy

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 3054 posts
  • Gender:Female

Posted 03 March 2009 - 11:36 PM

Oi, give credit where credit's due. That was clearly copied and pasted from here, meaning you don't understand the concept enough to explain it yourself, and probably just searched Google for a quick explanation, not able to come up with one on your own. I honestly cba to read through all of that, so I'll just go through the first bit.

"Concept and design necessitate an intelligent designer. The presence of intelligent design proves the existence of an intelligent designer."
It does not. At the beginning of the time of the universe, the entropy allotted in that amount of space was incredibly high. Disorder and chaos were at their maximum, obviously the opposite of anything that could be considered 'intelligent' design. As time goes on, and the universe expands, order increases because the entropy, though not remaining constant, is spread out over a much greater area. Essentially, room for order > entropy. Eventually, any system that is constantly increasing will become more ordered as time goes on, and since the universe is at least 15 billion years old, there's been plenty of time for order. This order may seem like 'intelligent design', but really, it's just nature doing its thing.

I don't believe in gods, ghosts, spirits, reincarnation, or any of that stuff.

  • 0

#10 CuteSparklezGirl

CuteSparklezGirl

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 976 posts

Posted 03 March 2009 - 11:39 PM

Oi, give credit where credit's due. That was clearly copied and pasted from here, meaning you don't understand the concept enough to explain it yourself, and probably just searched Google for a quick explanation, not able to come up with one on your own. I honestly cba to read through all of that, so I'll just go through the first bit.

"Concept and design necessitate an intelligent designer. The presence of intelligent design proves the existence of an intelligent designer."
It does not. At the beginning of the time of the universe, the entropy allotted in that amount of space was incredibly high. Disorder and chaos were at their maximum, obviously the opposite of anything that could be considered 'intelligent' design. As time goes on, and the universe expands, order increases because the entropy, though not remaining constant, is spread out over a much greater area. Essentially, room for order > entropy. Eventually, any system that is constantly increasing will become more ordered as time goes on, and since the universe is at least 15 billion years old, there's been plenty of time for order. This order may seem like 'intelligent design', but really, it's just nature doing its thing.

I don't believe in gods, ghosts, spirits, reincarnation, or any of that stuff.



Oh my god... you are right... I went to Google.(feeling guilty) Maybe you are right... You never know.
  • 0




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users