Mafia VI: Gangs of Denbrain

[Guest]

There was no way for frozen to find out what pw0nzd told to the inspector. So:

HE IS TELLING THE TRUTH.

I don't understand why this means that Frozen is telling the truth. I would expect that part of coming in as a backup would be receiving a copy of all the relevant correspondences between host and the original player. Unless I'm misunderstanding your statement, which is possible.

Frozen is lying about being the Janitor, and I don't see that CrazyPainter's question clears him; like I said, the Mafia killed the Ninja on the night in question...(of course I admit I am not entirely unbiased in this discussion, but that's how it is. )

Edited August 18, 2008 by dawh

[unreality]

I don't think so. Ninja was killed on Night two while pw0nzd was arrested on day two.

Frozen_1 was the Ninja, and was killed by the Mafia on night two. Pw0nzd was arrested on day two, the following day, and later became Frozen_2, who is different from Frozen_1

[unreality]

the roster:

Host: Unreality

1) GC - DEAD [Mafioso - Bankroller] Killed by Yakuza

2) Frozen - DEAD [Ninja] Killed by Mafia

3) Frost

4) Brandonb

5) Dawh - voting for Frozen_2

6) Ysan - DEAD [Yakuza] Lynched

7) LIS - DEAD [Defender] Lynched

8) Clueless - DEAD [QA] Alias discovered

9) Twoaday - DEAD [QA] Alias discovered

10) Cherry Lane - DEAD [?] Killed by Mafia

11) Johnson - voting for dawh

12) Puzzlegirl - DEAD [street Vendor] Dispatched by Mafia

13) Phaze - DEAD [?] Killed by Grim Reaper

14) Mekal

15) Rene

16) CrazyPainter - voting for Frozen_2

17) Frozen_2 - cannot vote

18) Dusty - DEAD [Grim Reaper] Killed by Ninja

19) LM - voting for Brandonb

20) Dnae - DEAD [Mafioso] Masked Lover

21) CL_2 - voting for dawh

[Guest]

If your are still voting for frozen then:

1) You didn't understand what I'm saying.

2) You are deliberately voting for an innocent.

3) There is something wrong with my logic.

For (1) and (3), I would say:

Assuming CP to be policewoman:

CP asked, with whom was pw0nzd yesterday night. He said, he was with ninja.

We know from the night two post that janitor really was with ninja. It means that:

1) pw0nzd is a baddie and had already planned to chose janitor to be his role.

2) pw0nzd is telling the truth.

Now, frozen_2 claims himself (pw0nzd) to be janitor.

Now, for frozen, there is no way of knowing that pw0nzd had planned to chose janitor to be his role.

So:

HE IS TELLING THE TRUTH.

EDIT: Made certain things bold.

Edited August 18, 2008 by esjohnson

[Guest]

Frozen_1 was the Ninja, and was killed by the Mafia on night two. Pw0nzd was arrested on day two, the following day, and later became Frozen_2, who is different from Frozen_1

That was precisely, what I said.

[Guest]

If your are still voting for frozen then:

1) You didn't understand what I'm saying.

2) You are deliberately voting for an innocent.

3) There is something wrong with my logic.

For (1) and (3), I would say:

Assuming CP to be policewoman:

CP asked, with whom was pw0nzd yesterday night. He said, he was with ninja.

We know from the night two post that janitor really was with ninja. It means that:

1) pw0nzd is a baddie and had already planned to chose janitor to be his role.

2) pw0nzd is telling the truth.

Now, frozen_2 claims himself (pw0nzd) to be janitor.

Now, for frozen there is no way of knowing that pw0nzd had planned to chose janitor to be his role.

So:

HE IS TELLING THE TRUTH.

EDIT: Made certain things bold.

But like I've been saying, the Mafia were also with the Ninja that night (in a manner of speaking) and that the Janitor had the option of killing someone (we don't know who from the night post,) but chose not to. The fact that the Janitor was mentioned with the Ninja in the night post does not guarantee that he was there (and that's not who I targeted.) If Frozen is telling the truth about being with the Ninja, then he could be the janitor, but he could just as easily be a mafioso.

[Guest]

If your are still voting for frozen then:

1) You didn't understand what I'm saying.

2) You are deliberately voting for an innocent.

3) There is something wrong with my logic.

For (1) and (3), I would say:

Assuming CP to be policewoman:

CP asked, with whom was pw0nzd yesterday night. He said, he was with ninja.

We know from the night two post that janitor really was with ninja. It means that:

1) pw0nzd is a baddie and had already planned to chose janitor to be his role.

2) pw0nzd is telling the truth.

Now, frozen_2 claims himself (pw0nzd) to be janitor.

Now, for frozen, there is no way of knowing that pw0nzd had planned to chose janitor to be his role.

So:

HE IS TELLING THE TRUTH.

EDIT: Made certain things bold.

esjohnson: I mostly agree with you, up to your last point (before bolding). As Frost and I discussed a few posts ago, the host should have given frozen[2] a rundown of what transpired with his role when he took over - so he's as prepared as possible to play that role. Its not easy to take over a role in the middle, since you haven't been approaching the game from that particular angle, but the host fills in whatever details he can. At least he did for me. For example, when I took over I asked what SB-1 had lie-detected. (even though she had posted it previously, I just didn't want to have to go look it up. Then later I had to look it up anyway, for LM). So I'm pretty sure Frozen [2] knows what was asked and answered when pw0nzd was in jail. He is likely innocent, but not positively.

[unreality]

In case anyone didn't know, the prisoner can lie or say something completely different, etc, to the Policeman. And also, this is directed to Johnson, it WOULD be bad logic to base an assertion off of something out-of-game like Frozen not knowing what Pw0nzd was planning in the replacement, you don't know how I handled the replacement or how much I told Frozen about Pw0nzd's plans/ideas/etc. Metagaming (basing knowledge outside of the game) is NOT a good practice and is frowned upon

[Guest]

If Frozen is telling the truth about being with the Ninja, then he could be the janitor, but he could just as easily be a mafioso.

Frozen didn't said that he was with Ninja. It was pw0nzd.

[Guest]

Frozen didn't said that he was with Ninja. It was pw0nzd.

But they are the same person right now, so I'm confused about your objection.

Whatever pw0nzd did, Frozen did by proxy.

[Guest]

Redirecting the conversation:

So far there are votes for Frozen, dawh, and Brandonb. So it looks like we think the two remaining baddies are {Frozen or dawh, but not both} and {Brandonb}. Are there any other suspects?

Host: Unreality

1) GC - DEAD [Mafioso - Bankroller] Killed by Yakuza

2) Frozen - DEAD [Ninja] Killed by Mafia

3) Frost

4) Brandonb

5) Dawh - voting for Frozen_2

6) Ysan - DEAD [Yakuza] Lynched

7) LIS - DEAD [Defender] Lynched

8) Clueless - DEAD [QA] Alias discovered

9) Twoaday - DEAD [QA] Alias discovered

10) Cherry Lane - DEAD [?] Killed by Mafia

11) Johnson - voting for dawh

12) Puzzlegirl - DEAD [street Vendor] Dispatched by Mafia

13) Phaze - DEAD [?] Killed by Grim Reaper

14) Mekal

15) Rene

16) CrazyPainter - voting for Frozen_2

17) Frozen_2 - cannot vote

18) Dusty - DEAD [Grim Reaper] Killed by Ninja

19) LM - voting for Brandonb

20) Dnae - DEAD [Mafioso] Masked Lover

21) CL_2 - voting for dawh

Edited August 18, 2008 by Cherry Lane

[Guest]

Sorry guys and sorry unreality for metagaming. I didn't realize that I was doing something wrong. I'm sure that it really hurts the host if he sees such posts.

Unreality puts in a lot of effort to make the game as realistic as possible. I don't feel as if I'm playing a game. It seems as if I'm watching a movie.

Instead of saying "QA chose him to kill. Docter PMed me her to save.........etc", he makes it a story. That's what makes the game interesting and addictive.

And what am I giving him in return? just making the game fake.

Sorry unreality, I'm really feeling bad about what I've done.

I should have acted as if no replacement had occured.

Sorry guys, don't go with my logic.

[Guest]

frozen_2 is either telling the truth, or is lying.

[Guest]

I AM TELLING THE TRUTH! Please believe me. dawh is a baddie. i am INNOCENT

Edited August 18, 2008 by frozen_in_fire

[Guest]

Sorry guys and sorry unreality for metagaming. I didn't realize that I was doing something wrong. I'm sure that it really hurts the host if he sees such posts.

Unreality puts in a lot of effort to make the game as realistic as possible. I don't feel as if I'm playing a game. It seems as if I'm watching a movie.

Instead of saying "QA chose him to kill. Docter PMed me her to save.........etc", he makes it a story. That's what makes the game interesting and addictive.

And what am I giving him in return? just making the game fake.

Sorry unreality, I'm really feeling bad about what I've done.

I should have acted as if no replacement had occured.

Sorry guys, don't go with my logic.

Don't beat yourself up over it. With formerly dead people coming back to replace others who have to leave, it gets confusing. No harm, no foul.

I just wanted to make sure that everyone was coming to a logical conclusion based on valid analysis of the situation (and I didn't want to be lynched for a lie ) That being said, everyone should still examine the data and pick the person they think is most likely lying. I'm just presenting my case.

[Guest]

I AM TELLING THE TRUTH! Please believe me. dawh is a baddie. i am INNOCENT

Will you answer my earlier question: who did the janitor pick on the second night that he later decided not to kill?

[Guest]

well, I was the ninja at that time... but pw0nzd shared his choice with me. However, didn't unreality say that I was supposed to act like I didn't know anything from my days as ninja?

[Guest]

Ok dawh and frozen, I'm off to sleep. I don't know what's your clock is saying, mine says its 1:50 AM.

There is a tie between you both now.

Fight and convince the non-voters.

I'll leave this up to the non-voters to decide upon who to lynch.

[Guest]

well, I was the ninja at that time... but pw0nzd shared his choice with me. However, didn't unreality say that I was supposed to act like I didn't know anything from my days as ninja?

yes, but you are supposed to act as if you were Frozen2 the whole time. So if you really are the janitor, unreality would have told you all that transpired between him and pw0nzd, and you would know BECAUSE OF THAT who the janitor targeted.

[Guest]

ah, of course. On night one, I picked PG and saved her. On night two, I picked dawh but did not kill him.

[Guest]

well, I was the ninja at that time... but pw0nzd shared his choice with me. However, didn't unreality say that I was supposed to act like I didn't know anything from my days as ninja?

Frozen, you should not act like that.

There is no replacement.

The Frozen who we knew as Ninja is dead.

[Guest]

ah, of course. On night one, I picked PG and saved her. On night two, I picked dawh but did not kill him.

Any idea why not?

[Guest]

Frozen, you should not act like that.

There is no replacement.

The Frozen who we knew as Ninja is dead.

ah. I must have confused myself with someone else. so terribly sorry.

[unreality]

esj: no problem Like dawh said, no harm no foul, and it didn't affect the game at all because nobody except me and Frozen know how much I told Frozen about Pw0nzd's roles/plans/etc. Links and roster:

Mafia VI Rules, Roles, Voting Help

Mafia VI Intro

Night One - Cliff Jumping

During Day One - Mekal's Suffrage

During Day One - No More Tacos

Day One - Azure Sky

Night Two - Fly By Night

Day Two - Triple Kill

Night Three - Reaction Time

During Day Three - Frozen Number Two

Host: Unreality

1) GC - DEAD [Mafioso - Bankroller] Killed by Yakuza

2) Frozen - DEAD [Ninja] Killed by Mafia

3) Frost

4) Brandonb

5) Dawh - voting for Frozen_2

6) Ysan - DEAD [Yakuza] Lynched

7) LIS - DEAD [Defender] Lynched

8) Clueless - DEAD [QA] Alias discovered

9) Twoaday - DEAD [QA] Alias discovered

10) Cherry Lane - DEAD [?] Killed by Mafia

11) Johnson - voting for dawh

12) Puzzlegirl - DEAD [street Vendor] Dispatched by Mafia

13) Phaze - DEAD [?] Killed by Grim Reaper

14) Mekal

15) Rene

16) CrazyPainter - voting for Frozen_2

17) Frozen_2 - cannot vote

18) Dusty - DEAD [Grim Reaper] Killed by Ninja

19) LM - voting for Brandonb

20) Dnae - DEAD [Mafioso] Masked Lover

21) CL_2 - voting for dawh

[Guest]

But like I've been saying, the Mafia were also with the Ninja that night (in a manner of speaking) and that the Janitor had the option of killing someone (we don't know who from the night post,) but chose not to. The fact that the Janitor was mentioned with the Ninja in the night post does not guarantee that he was there (and that's not who I targeted.) If Frozen is telling the truth about being with the Ninja, then he could be the janitor, but he could just as easily be a mafioso.

Ummm...no, if he was a mafioso, why would he say that he was with the ninja? To give away that he is a mafioso? That makes no sense, he woud just lie and say he was with someone else.

Oh and unreality, when do you plan to end this day? will it be at 11:30pm or have you changed it?

I'd also like to hear from Brandonb before this day ends.

Edited August 18, 2008 by Frost