changing fate.

[Guest]

(this is a pretty easy one)

If you were to find out that your fate was to die in two days,

and this was truly your destiny, (in other words. no bogus phsychics involved) and you only know that you will die, but don't know the actions which will cause your death.

What is the one, surefire way to insure this fate does not come true?

[Guest]

Kill yourself today.

This changes fate because you did not die in two days.

However....... Your'e still dead!

[unreality]

this one's very easy... but nothing is destiny if you know about it... you can always change it if it gives a specific day or time or whatever.... or if it truly is, maybe you would be like that guy from France who wanted to commit suicide so he tied a noose around his neck, the other end securely to a pole ontop of a cliff high over the ocean. He set himself on fire, took poison, and jumped off to hang himself, he also carried a gun to shoot himself on the way down (and this is a true story). The gun shot thru the rope so he didnt get hung (or shot) and he fell and splashed into the ocean, which put out the flames and he coughed up the poison (again, this is a true story). And the last resort was to drown, but he didnt drown because a kind fisherman rescued him... and he died in the hospital later.

say if you were the guy that was supposed to die in two days.. "later" could mean two days later. if it truly was destined to happen your suicide could fail. hm. whatever.

[Guest]

Well, normdeplume had the answer I was looking for.

But I don't believe in fate or destiny anyways, so it doesn't matter to me.

[Guest]

Well, normdeplume had the answer I was looking for.

What? You can't kill yourself earlier than two days away because your riddle states, "your fate was to die in two days" and "this was truly your destiny". C'mon man, your answer can't fail to adhere to the conditions of your own riddle!

I was thinking it would be something like lying your body right down the center of the international date line or something like that to screw with fate's metaphorical head.

But I don't believe in fate or destiny anyways, so it doesn't matter to me.

You don't have to for a riddle's sake. Most of us don't believe that liars and truthtellers exist that can only lie or tell the truth.

BTW, destiny is real. All of your decisions are based on the brain nature gave you and all of your past experiences. Since you had no choices in either of those, free will is an illusion.

[Guest]

It says your fate is to die in two days. Let's say you find this out Monday, but on Wednesday you wouldn't need to worry about dieing untill Friday. and then on Friday not untill Sunday. ect... It's not explained well, so i hope you all understand. It's playing on us always living in the present while the future never truely comes. It's where my mind went first.

Mary had a little lamb and the doctor fainted

[Guest]

It says your fate is to die in two days. Let's say you find this out Monday, but on Wednesday you wouldn't need to worry about dieing untill Friday.

Someone remind me to never lend money to Aaron Burr with the caveat that he is to pay me in x number of days.

[unreality]

BTW, destiny is real. All of your decisions are based on the brain nature gave you and all of your past experiences. Since you had no choices in either of those, free will is an illusion.

You shouldnt be going around saying that like its fact. Maybe thats what you believe, but dont try to say that like its a true fact or something.

Your decisions are based on your brain nature and past experiences, etc, we still don't know how the brain works, and if you go around thinking you dont have free will, life has no meaning. It's the LazyBones paradox. Life is based on free will. On unpredictability. So get over it and go have some fun!

i dont believe in destiny. or fate. But thats what i believe.

and even if everything is chemically fixed inside our brains, nobody can determine that, so you wouldnt know you wer going to die in 2 days anyway. Your brain doesnt have knowledge like that. That would have to be a combination of millions of ppl's brains and their actions to get you into that spot.

yeah. all i'm saying is that its just a riddle, nothing more

[unreality]

It says your fate is to die in two days. Let's say you find this out Monday, but on Wednesday you wouldn't need to worry about dieing untill Friday.

Someone remind me to never lend money to Aaron Burr with the caveat that he is to pay me in x number of days.

there are more solutions than just one. Aaron Burr is just taking advantage of the wording... what's wrong with that?

lol btw aaron, i love the mary had a little lamb thing

[unreality]

sorry Martini.

ignore my posts.

I was in a bad mood. lol.

[Guest]

You shouldnt be going around saying that like its fact. Maybe thats what you believe, but dont try to say that like its a true fact or something.

What part is not fact?

Your decisions are based on your brain nature and past experiences, etc, we still don't know how the brain works, and if you go around thinking you dont have free will, life has no meaning.

Are you convinced that life does have meaning?

Life is based on free will.

Or the illusion of free will.

and even if everything is chemically fixed inside our brains, nobody can determine that, so you wouldnt know you wer going to die in 2 days anyway.

Well, the point is, for the intent and purpose of the riddle, we have to assume that there is such a thing as a being that can tell us our fate. Just as for some riddles we have to assume we can travel at light speed, that liars and truthtellers exist, etc.

there are more solutions than just one. Aaron Burr is just taking advantage of the wording... what's wrong with that?

He didn't take advantage of the wording. He broke the conditions of the wording. Not picking on Aarron, it's just important to mention on a board that's all about riddles that answers MUST adhere to the conditions brought forth in the riddle.

sorry Martini.

ignore my posts.

I was in a bad mood. lol.

Well, I would have ignored them if I had free will. :icon_eek:

You didn't delete them, so I didn't ignore them. No problem though, bro. A little friendly disagreement on deep subjects is not a bigee.

[Guest]

I think we got a little off the point.

This riddle was a question that we talked about at school.

When I brought up killing yourself the teacher changed the subject.

I don't really agree or disagree with aaron's idea.

The future will never come, but a certain date in the future will.

in other words tommorow will never come, yet January 1st 2008 will.

because the next day, the word tommorow will mean a different day.

The idea that the suicide would fail makes perfect sense as well.

but if destiny is real, there is no way to change it,

because you do not know what actions will cause you to die in two days. there is also no Dr. Brown or flying DeLorian to change the past with.

[Guest]

The future will never come, but a certain date in the future will.

in other words tommorow will never come, yet January 1st 2008 will.

because the next day, the word tommorow will mean a different day.

I don't really agree with the statement "tomorrow will never come."

Tomorrow would mean the day after today. I think we can all agree on that.

In that sense, tomorrow will come. It will come the next day. The day after today will come tomorrow.

What you could say is that it will never be tomorrow. It can't be tomorrow, because tomorrow will always be they day after today.

So tomorrow will come, but it can never be tomorrow.

[Guest]

Ok yea, you got me there

[Guest]

how comes that you know a priori that something is gonna happen, let alone in a certain day, when you then can act in a way which possibly falsifies the fore-knowledge; May be this fore-knowledge is possible in a case -say- of a serious cancer, or the like. But there is a plethora of every-day situations where the fore-knowledge of your exact destiny is problematic, for the fact that it promotes actions which lead to it;s falsification (suppose a medium who would predict that you 're gonna die in two days in a car accident and you know it. If you're a superstitious man, it's easy:you simply avoid to get in any vehicle this day

[Guest]

Yes, but a man could kidnap you and force you into a car.

You did everything you could to avoid it, but it happened anyway.

Yeah, I was wrong from the beginning,

regardless of my real beliefs, for the sake of a riddle if a fourtune is made and it is true. . . Well, then it is true..

No matter what you do, what is destined to happen will happen

[Guest]

Your example is good, but what i mean is that the notion of (exact) fore-knowledge is problematic, for -despite cases like the one you mentioned- it promotes -either theoretically or practically- action that can falsify it. And, as we know, in real world there are multiple possible ways or combinations of acts, in order to avoid something in a secure way

[Guest]

Your example is good, but what i mean is that the notion of (exact) fore-knowledge is problematic, for -despite cases like the one you mentioned- it promotes -either theoretically or practically- action that can falsify it. And, as we know, in real world there are multiple possible ways or combinations of acts, in order to avoid something in a secure way

The whole point of destiny/fate (if one believes in such a thing) is that no matter WHAT you do, you can't get away from it. If someone told me that my destiny was to NOT touch my face with my hands for 2 days, of course the first thing I'm going to try to do is touch my face. However, if it were REALLY, TRULY my destiny, something would happen right then and there that would make me unable to touch my face for two days... maybe two sprained shoulders making me unable to lift my arms. Maybe right at that moment, someone knocks me unconscious and ties my arms down for two days. The point is, if you believe in destiny/fate, then you can't say that foreknowledge is problematic because your foreknowledge wouldn't do anything for you... in fact, you finding out beforehand is possibly what destiny/fate is going to use to cause the aforementioned destiny to come true.... Just like in the OP.

If your actual destiny/fate were to die in 2 days, and you tried to kill yourself, it's very likely that you would fatally injure yourself and you would die 2 DAYS LATER in the hospital... so, it was actually YOUR KNOWLEDGE of your destiny/fate that caused your destiny/fate to happen.

It's all circular.

@ Martini

I can choose to eat this candy bar, or not. That's free will. If you think it's just conditioning, or that it's preconceived notions that cause me to choose one, then it's the EXACT same thing as free will. I might choose to eat it because I LIKE candy bars (that's a preconceived notion). I also could choose to NOT eat it if I didn't like candy bars (that too would be a preconceived notion).

If I decide to go to a baseball game, and you tell me that was my destiny, what happens if I decide NOT to go? Well then, THAT all of a sudden becomes my destiny... so it seems that while my destiny, according to those who believe in it, had been set all this time and that it was to NOT go to the game all along, It is the exact same as free will because I CHOSE not to go to the game and my destiny just KNEW what I was going to choose before I chose it. It all amounts to the same. We all do things based on knowledge, desires, emotions and instincts. You call it destiny/fate. I call it free will.

[Guest]

I am of those who in any case believe that if something is going to happen, it is certain that it will happen. What i actually mean -and perhaps thewre was a misinterpretation of my view- is that it will certainly happen, but it is problematic for us -human beings- to know a priori that it will happen (at a time t, in a place a, in a way z etc). Thus, the problem is not in the world out there, but in our knowledge about the world and the infinite states-of-affairs included in this world

[Guest]

I am of those who in any case believe that if something is going to happen, it is certain that it will happen. What i actually mean -and perhaps thewre was a misinterpretation of my view- is that it will certainly happen, but it is problematic for us -human beings- to know a priori that it will happen (at a time t, in a place a, in a way z etc). Thus, the problem is not in the world out there, but in our knowledge about the world and the infinite states-of-affairs included in this world

Yeah, I guess it was a misinterpretation because you said:

it promotes -either theoretically or practically- action that can falsify it.

But this isn't the case. Theoretically it could create an action that might falsify it, but practically there is no action that can falsify destiny/fate... if there was, then destiny/fate would no longer exist... if it exists in the first place...

I think I'm also misunderstanding what the "problem" is. What problem is there in our knowledge about the world etc. etc. if we find out what destiny awaits us?

[unreality]

I don't believe in destiny or fate or non-free-will mostly because of randomness at particle levels and my own beliefs (agnostic/atheistic)

But if you COULD look into the future, it would change. For example take the movie NEXT (great movie if you wanna rent it). Like he says somewhere in the beginning... "every time you look into the future it changes, just because you looked" (and now know what would happen thus changing it). He can only look into his own future and this one girl's future but even if there was no such limitation just KNOWING the possible future would CHANGE it BECAUSE you know it. Destiny isnt fixed... I believe you could change your fate, if it existed. The "fate" that people have talked about that they say will happen no matter what anybody does to change it requires the power of some higher intelligent being that wants that to happen and can influence events..

[bonanova]

(this is a pretty easy one)

If you were to find out that your fate was to die in two days,

and this was truly your destiny, (in other words. no bogus phsychics involved) and you only know that you will die, but don't know the actions which will cause your death.

What is the one, surefire way to insure this fate does not come true?

Normdeplume trashed the destiny thing by pointing out you could commit suicide before then.

Knowing that action removes my death's certainty, I don't have actually to do it.

I'd switch channels and just continue living normally.