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time travel


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#11 Writersblock

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Posted 28 December 2007 - 01:10 AM

I think you all miss the concept of space/time. As I understand it, time is merely a function of "place." Therefore you could, in theory, jump from one "place" to another.

Also, it seems that everyone sort of assumes a "beginning" of time and a linear path along which we all travel. What if it's not?

Consider this: what if we all are beings that exist in every dimension? What if what we experience here is merely a portion of our true "selves?" Imagine that we all exist in every point in time and outside of time simultaneously, and that the reality of "now" is merely a reflection of self. The TRUE self can see every point in time and is the true being of what we are. Imagine this present reality as a sort of "unconscious" of the true being that is "self." Therefore if you could travel from point A to point B in the time continuum, you would meet a version of yourself. It might not be any different than suddenly realizing in this reality a subconscious motivation for your actions. It wouldn't cause any sort of paradox at all, it would just enlighten you as to who you "really" are.

Anyone follow what I'm getting at?
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#12 Writersblock

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Posted 28 December 2007 - 01:13 AM

As a follow up, think of "time" as an endless book. Think of yourself both as the person reading the book, and also having a "reflection" of yourself in the book as a character. Now, the person "reading" can flip from one page to the other at will to see what happens. The "character" cannot. The "character" is stuck in time and can only remember the past, consider the present, and dream the future. The "reader" can not only see any page of the book and what happens, but can also put down the book and pick up another story.


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#13 Nexus

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Posted 28 December 2007 - 06:52 AM

I agree with you. "Time" is merely a construct of our minds. It is something we use to define the world we live in. "Time" does not move or change it is constant. It is past, present, and future. We perceive time moving because of our own limited consciousness and understanding. I also believe that we inhabit a multiverse that is infinite in all ways and that there is a unvierse for every possibility. So if TT was possible it would not actually be moving through time or stepping outside time but merely moving from one universe to another. The trick would not be moving from universe to universe but doing so with a control and direction so that you could choose the universe with the point of "TIME" that you desired to be at. By travelling this way you would not be creating universes but joining ones that already exist. And I really wish that everyone one on this forum would quit using the word "PARADOX" like its some type of stupidity band aid. There is no such thing as a PARADOX. That is the answer of someone who is unable to find the solution to a problem and whos ego will not admit that they are in some way lacking. Simple logic says that if the universe we inhabit is infinite and every conceivable and unconceivable scenario has,is,will happen then a paradox would have already occurred thus destroy the universe in which we inhabit but since we are here discussing these theories then it would be safe to say that said paradox is an impossibility. I find your views very refreshing Writersblock. I have only joined recently but I have yet to read any truly original thinking besides yours.
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#14 roolstar

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Posted 28 December 2007 - 11:53 AM

Well let me put it this way then:

If I could, I would gladly go back in time and never write any posts on this subject...

I am just afraid to go into an infinite multi-universe full of possibilities in multi-dimension states of being where the absence of my conscious can only be reflected by the presence of my subconscious throughout a past-present-future state of ever existing being that will eventually define my true self...

You know what? I find my ego more protected behind these very long, very badly defined words, you're right Nexus thanks...

No more posts on this subject for me...
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#15 stwalk

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Posted 28 December 2007 - 03:00 PM

Well I have comletely enjoyed all the theory's, thoughts, ideas and conjecturs through the last few days. Allow me to offer this, I do contest without wanting to get into a philisophical debate, that TT into the future is not possible. In like manner stated before that when you TT forward in time (understood time is relative) say 50 years you would have disapeared for the then past 50 years the rest of the world's people would not have jumped time that fast as well because your body is still on the "you" present time line and therefore you would be all alone. Do not forget that all matter i.e. trees, animals ....ect. are beholden to that same timeline as well and therefore you would then be in a void of nothing. And time itself is beholden to that same law of physics and therefore, even time would not exist so now you would not exist and cant TT back in time to the relative present and you would have disapeared al together into nothing. (TT forward cant work). [i]Hope that was followable Secondly I would like to offer that after the first few post no one addressed the issue of re-intoduction of energy in the form of matter through TT backwards..... it would negate the ability of TT. It would not simply be a ballance level as stated by a privious text in that "if you TT back say 3 hours when you returned the ballance would equal out" (paraphrazed)... because lets say you traveled back 100 years and never re-entered nrmal time (as we know it) you would have then re-introduced a level of energy that had never preiously existed before on that Time line and therefore would upset the ballance. After much ocncideration I DO NOT BELIVE TT IS POSSIBLE IN ANY SHAPE OR FORM OR EVER WILL BE. Nothing more than a sci-fi fiction fun theme for movis and books and somthing for little boys (and bored adults it seems) to think about. Thak you for all who have replyied to my post, look for more for there will be more to look for.

- Just a thought
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#16 Writersblock

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Posted 28 December 2007 - 06:16 PM

Secondly I would like to offer that after the first few post no one addressed the issue of re-intoduction of energy in the form of matter



You are wrong. I did address it. I think you are misunderstanding the laws of thermodynamics. The re-introduction of mass (energy) into the universe doesn't affect these laws. The law only says that you cannot create nor destroy one without the other. (i.e. you destroy mass and get energy, you create energy from mass and vice versa). The total universal amount does not have to be on some cosmic "balance." Therefore you aren't implicating the conservation of mass and energy by introducing "new" energy unless that energy is coming from "nothing."

Again, think of walking into a room. All you are doing is rearranging the configuration of mass and energy in the universe. String theory pretty much bears up that matter exists across dimensions (as I understand it) - so would energy. TT would merely be a reconfiguration, exactly like walking into a room.


your body is still on the "you" present time line


Again, you are stuck on the notion that time is a linear "thing" and that you are stuck on a "two dimensional" configuration of time. Read up on space/time and you'll get a better picture. As I said before, time is a function of space. Imagine you are in park. You want to go from point A to the swings. You can go straight to them, in a linear manner, or you can meander and go elsewhere. You could hit the slide first, you could get a drink first, you could even return to point A and go further away from the swings if you wanted. In fact, you could run in a circle staying exactly the same distance from the swings, returning to point A after a bit. Time should be similar. We just lack the capacity to "move" in that dimension. Just because our conciousness is locked into a linear definition of time doesn't mean our thinking need be.
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#17 stwalk

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Posted 28 December 2007 - 08:39 PM

where again did you get your physics degree cus mine is from MIT phd in physics and thermodynamics class of 92. your wrong. not being rude or wanting to get you in a fluffle and hate to burst yourbubble but you should do some teroretical HW
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#18 unreality

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Posted 29 December 2007 - 04:48 AM

I agree with you. "Time" is merely a construct of our minds. It is something we use to define the world we live in. "Time" does not move or change it is constant. It is past, present, and future. We perceive time moving because of our own limited consciousness and understanding. I also believe that we inhabit a multiverse that is infinite in all ways and that there is a unvierse for every possibility. So if TT was possible it would not actually be moving through time or stepping outside time but merely moving from one universe to another. The trick would not be moving from universe to universe but doing so with a control and direction so that you could choose the universe with the point of "TIME" that you desired to be at. By travelling this way you would not be creating universes but joining ones that already exist. And I really wish that everyone one on this forum would quit using the word "PARADOX" like its some type of stupidity band aid. There is no such thing as a PARADOX. That is the answer of someone who is unable to find the solution to a problem and whos ego will not admit that they are in some way lacking. Simple logic says that if the universe we inhabit is infinite and every conceivable and unconceivable scenario has,is,will happen then a paradox would have already occurred thus destroy the universe in which we inhabit but since we are here discussing these theories then it would be safe to say that said paradox is an impossibility.




I'm sorry to say you are wrong. Your impression of infinity is wrong. Yes, our universe MAY be infinite. It probably is. I'm saying "may" cuz I have no idea- nobody has any idea. But if it is, you are still wrong.

Imagine this:

...000000000...

An infinite number of zeroes. But there are no ones present. All zeroes.

...0202020202...

Still infinite, with some more variety... still no ones.

...abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz023456789abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz023456789...

Imagine that's the universe, lots of variety and whatnot. But no ones.

Just because something is infinite it doesn't mean everything exists.


***
writersblock: you are right about the conservation of mass and energy (which are the same thing, right?... well actually that's not relevant). You take both mass and energy from one time and move it to another. It still exists in the universe. No problems there
***
writersblock again: I like your thinking about time as another dimension, just like space. But you're forgetting something.
0 dimensions- a single point
1 dimension (1d)- a line
2d- a circle/square/etc
3d- a sphere/cube/prism/etc
4d- time, thus both the 3 dimensions of space, AND time

Assuming that this is what you're getting at, and I think it is, about Space and Time- you are thinking that Space and Time are equal in number of dimensions, and that Time is also 3 dimensions that we move around in, and that time isnt linear.

Going back to your logic (assuming 4d is space and time) this isnt true- time IS linear. It's just one dimension added on. 1d is a line. Time would be linear. Go back to my post and read about the parallel universes... this works for linear time, though it could also be applied to 5d or 6d time, like you are suggesting (6d could be 3 dimensions of time, 3 dimensions of space- though there is hyperspace and superspace and what not for complex geometry, so there might even be more dimensions of space, and more of time as well, who knows), then my theory of parallel universes would still work regardless of how many dimensions in each universe. So, writersblock, I think our theories kind of work together.
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#19 unreality

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Posted 29 December 2007 - 05:21 PM

jeez I never thought of that.
When you go into the future, there's not really an alternate you that didn't go to the future, and stayed in the ever moving present.
Man...
Back to the Future II lied to me.



yep. THough they did it right in the first movie and the third movie, so I dont know what's up with that. Maybe they went forward then went back and lived their lives to be that old. This is paradox-wrought, though, of course.

Though with my parallel universe theory, you would go forward, there would be no you, you would go back (creating a new parallel universe from the universe you just came from, so they have the same history up the point you traveled back to and split off a new universe). So now there are 2 of you in this universe, 0 in the one you came from. NOW you can go forward and see yourself aged.

I've thought and thought and thought and with my theory there are NO paradoxes...
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#20 Ploper

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Posted 30 December 2007 - 12:46 AM

your wrong.


wow, the simple "you're wrong"
that's something I haven't seen on these boards for a while
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