[Guest]

Sign up to peace club in the sign-up thread!

This thread is for discussions on what you think about peace.

I haven't said where I stand yet, so I'll start off.

Not long ago I was one of those cynics who thought peace "ain't gonna happen", and that you need war to really feel the true value of proper peace. But it was easy for me to say that because I've never had to live in a wartorn country in fear for my life. In the past few few weeks my view has changed a lot. I think if we can stop our wars with our fellow man, let's. War is unnecessary.

Edited August 13, 2008 by lemonymelon

[Guest]

well you over looked the serious bit slick - petition ALL countries

Peace on you too

[Guest]

I've found it in the second drawer in the big wooden thingie in my room

Word I was looking for was dresser...

What is the point slick of keep closing sown the replies as soon as they mention war, it's becoming anoying that you are constantly telling not to mention religion - though you have mentioned your own previous practice(s), or discuss war - which must be understood just as prostitution, drugs and unwanted pregnacies are dealt with ... Fact finding

Here is one idea to kick off with - petition each and every country for peace, ask them if they want peace, will stop wars, will disarm and will allow inspection (may need modification). Or we cld just recomend we all swap recepies. I am willing to learn about pasta dishes in particular

sorry if this irks you slick - I'm miffed at the over passive inactivity and closing down of replies

I know! I put a lot of thought and effort into my last post!! Also considering I had to type it twice, as my computer was completely spazzed and had to be rebooted, yet that post has been 100% ignored by everyone except, well.. You

We can now begin with the peaceful discussion that was meant in the first place

What discussion?

Honestly, if the people here who were trying to say that war is inevitable, and peace is just a theory. Well, if they stopped posting, this thread would find itself at the bottom of the page very quickly..

Power to the Peace Club.

You've said this twice now, to the best of my knowledge, and for some reason, it's just really bothering me.

I'm not asking you to stop, as I have no reason to.

But I dunno, there's just something odd about it.

[akaslickster]

No one is forcing any one to visit here. If it is a bother then Peace to you.

[Guest]

So many posts left unanswered...

If ignorance is the key to peace, then I believe you've found it.

Most definitely my last post here.

[akaslickster]

We support peacefulness and not argumentation. You can be a star in the war zone. Peace go with you my aquaintance.

[akaslickster]

PEACE CLUB SHALL LIVE ON !!! Always. Some one should go to each country I'm very busy. :-)

[Guest]

Dear founders of the peace club,

It is irking me that members and openly state that they either complete pacifists or will take defence stance for protection only; the latter is still taking up arms. Fine but....

Religion shall not come into it, yet has been commented and closed by a founder member, which leads to alienation/segregation of members that may need to 'check' where this 'club' is coming from or going to. Is this an atheist only group?

There seems to be one unwritten rule here - to not post anything that may be discussed or debated. The 'club' should have rules and guidance if it is to conform to a standard. I guess I have to take the blame for blindly signing to a 'club' on principal that it was to reach peace if only through understanding and promoting an ideology

It sticks in my craw me that the 'club' seems to appear more like a Utopian hiding hole. It's best that I leave as my suggestion seems to be a best frivolously treated. Further I am concerned that poking fun and rebutting members alienates and acts as a 'caution' to present and future members.

After 60 posts it has dissed members for checking they are on the same song sheet, suggesting ideas (music and petition), or thinking allowed for a positive reaction via quality input.

Please remove me from the 'club' as it seems to be lacking motivational input in my opinion and is not setting any goals or laying foundations

pls do not take this personally as this is meant to effectively note my disappointment, I do not have time to bang my head against the wall - good luck btw

I also accept it just may not suit me to 'club' in this fashion.

[Guest]

Well... here's my THIRD "last post" on this discussion...

I backup everything LIS said, but the main reason I posted was because I never actually requested to be withdrawn from the club, as well.

So yeah, I'd like to.

[Guest]

Religion shall not come into it, yet has been commented and closed by a founder member, which leads to alienation/segregation of members that may need to 'check' where this 'club' is coming from or going to. Is this an atheist only group?

wasn't meant to be. I think the idea was not to centre all our ideas about peace on religion as it leads to arguments, as this topic quite clearly demonstrates.

The 'club' should have rules and guidance if it is to conform to a standard.

maybe we'll work on it, maybe not. what do people want out of this club? It was meant to be a fun and informal thing. And one thing i will say is that ORIGINALLY THIS CLUB WAS A LIGHT-HEARTED JOKE between drydung and me, hence the old link to sockguy.com on my profile. Then grey cells and a few others joined the club and it beacme more than just a joke . Slick was invited and got really into it. I think there was about five of us at that time and we were communicating via pms about what we thought, many of which have been posted in the two PEACE CLUB threads. After the sign-up was made, I got a bit angry when i was continually being hounded by someone about this club not going anywhere. Then in my rage, I started the topic for this discussion thread which, evidently, has been a bit of a mess.

I admit, right now i'm a bit confused about where this is going. lots of us are a bit annoyed so lets cool off and maybe think about what you think this club could achieve. If in a while, you think this club is a bit pointless, by all means quit. I think for now I'll ride it out, God willing.

It sticks in my craw me that the 'club' seems to appear more like a Utopian hiding hole.

"utopian hiding hole" that made me laugh out loud. Not sure why though. It's a nice phrase. can i steal it?

oh and i agree with LIS about closing down of replies. which we shouldn't do. i think i've done that a bit here and in the sign up and i'll try to stop, God willing.

Edited September 6, 2008 by lemonymelon

[Guest]

wasn't meant to be. I think the idea was not to centre all our ideas about peace on religion as it leads to arguments, as this topic quite clearly demonstrates.

Well obviously with very little founder input it has not risen. Many signed up members are not adding or reading and there has to be reasons (busy, not bothered, frightened of having an opinion that is kicked to the kerb - albeit politely, it is still offensive to not properly discuss such a wide open subject. Peace is about many things, getting together on a forum and asking for conformity and excluding subjects is probably after they have been done to death

maybe we'll work on it, maybe not.

again too little to work with, it sounds like input is not required until the founders OK is given

what do people want out of this club?

I'm gonna start with a peace profile... think on that. What is peace to this club, as we are finding it vague - but you need to define it here and run other subjects in other threads.

It was meant to be a fun and informal thing. And one thing i will say is that ORIGINALLY THIS CLUB WAS A LIGHT-HEARTED JOKE between drydung and me, hence the old link to sockguy.com on my profile. Then grey cells and a few others joined the club and it became more than just a joke . Slick was invited and got really into it. I think there was about five of us at that time and we were communicating via pms about what we thought, many of which have been posted in the two PEACE CLUB threads.

Maybe it worked better as a clique/closed group???? btw - it should be fun and fulfilling!

After the sign-up was made, I got a bit angry when i was continually being hounded by someone about this club not going anywhere. Then in my rage, I started the topic for this discussion thread which, evidently, has been a bit of a mess.

Well it's easy to let our emotions control us - another topic I think,...self control/anger management ideas thread.... inner peace (first thing we all need to achieve as individuals)

I admit, right now i'm a bit confused about where this is going. lots of us are a bit annoyed so lets cool off and maybe think about what you think this club could achieve. If in a while, you think this club is a bit pointless, by all means quit. I think for now I'll ride it out, God willing...

true let things quieten down, though you don't have to encourage us to let god take control. I'm willing as a free thinking human being. We are all heading for a vexed outrage - I'll cut short as it's one reason I had to pull out - talking to brick walls is not my idea of inner peace. I tend to head off elsewhere for fun or fulfillment - often in BD

"utopian hiding hole" that made me laugh out loud. Not sure why though. It's a nice phrase. can i steal it?

ha ha!! technically what happens in the den stays in the den, unless you have admin permission - be my guest if admin are ok with it

oh and i agree with LIS about closing down of replies. which we shouldn't do. i think i've done that a bit here and in the sign up and i'll try to stop, God willing.

Well thanks - but this is again where we can start believing in each other rather than leaving it to a spirit that some people here are doubtful about and lets say a more than a little sceptical of. Otherwise we have to conform to one religion -Peace is my religion I guess (humanitarianism).

Anyway that's my last ubtill founders and others take it seriously or just play it as it is and I'll see if it is worth going back on the list - sorry, LM but I don't want to waste my time. (at 52 I have less left than most here)

I cldnt be bothered to add smileys - hope you realised there was some humour in there - I'll go unLISted thanks

[akaslickster]

Seemingly, this discussion thread has not been used so, I will use it right now. This has not been read and I am not the one who wrote it but I guess it goes here.

The history of human race is overshadowed by the history of wars. Is it not terrible to think that not a single year passed in the last 100 years when we were not fighting a war somewhere in this beautiful world? The last century witnessed the greatest of developments in the spheres of science, technology, culture and art. Yet it remains the century of most horrible crimes and biggest killings and genocides of human history so far. If you think it is all part of life then I am standing for the other part. Let us refuse to accept that this continuation of war and terror is the normal way of our life. A handful of people has no right to impose a perverse world order upon us. So join the peace club and say, "no to war, no to terror". If you say it today, someone else will say it tomorrow.

In the name of this peace club we can share our concerns and form a platform based on consensus. Check the 'Others' forum and join the club.

Go ahead and voice your thoughts. I am not arguing cuz Iam busy.

Edited September 7, 2008 by akaslickster

[unreality]

hmmm, slick, that sounds just like Drydung's About Me page ;D

[akaslickster]

hmmm, slick, that sounds just like Drydung's About Me page ;D

I thought that would get a discussion started but, he has'nt been out of his shell.

[Guest]

Seemingly, this discussion thread has not been used so, I will use it right now. This has not been read and I am not the one who wrote it but I guess it goes here.

The history of human race is overshadowed by the history of wars. Is it not terrible to think that not a single year passed in the last 100 years when we were not fighting a war somewhere in this beautiful world? The last century witnessed the greatest of developments in the spheres of science, technology, culture and art. Yet it remains the century of most horrible crimes and biggest killings and genocides of human history so far. If you think it is all part of life then I am standing for the other part. Let us refuse to accept that this continuation of war and terror is the normal way of our life. A handful of people has no right to impose a perverse world order upon us. So join the peace club and say, "no to war, no to terror". If you say it today, someone else will say it tomorrow.

In the name of this peace club we can share our concerns and form a platform based on consensus. Check the 'Others' forum and join the club.

Go ahead and voice your thoughts. I am not arguing cuz Iam busy.

I will agree with the no to war part,

as for this terror stuff, I'm one that believes the whole "Anti-Terror" campaign to be a fraud. IMHO 9-11 was an inside job conspired by our government to seize land and control over the middle east. A terrible tragedy to be true, but I cannot ignore the facts concerning it. So I will stand up for the "No to war" but I cannot firmly say "No to Terror" as the terror threat has been falsified to keep us in fear and under control. You may call me a conspiracy theorist if you want, all I wish to do is spread what feelings and thoughts i have on the matter to try to spread the truth about it.

With so many reasons for them to start fights for, what can average citizens really do to stop it?

I just wish we could all keep our politics/ beliefs to ourselves and let people "live and let live."

[Guest]

Slickster dude, my man!

why talk about peace when your at war with me? Tsk tsk tsk, such a shame... you have no choice but to act war with war... so why are you in a peace topic?

[Guest]

Hmm is it a bit hypocritical to post both here and the war club?

If so, oh well

Anyway, I do agree that peace is needed, war is annoying, terrorism is pointless. What we really need to end this war and begin a search for peace is to:

1# send in a group of hardened gang members, put them in some Cadillacs and old vans, drop em in Iraq and have them do drive-bys on all the terrorists.

If that doesn't work then

#2 Get a bunch of rednecks, give 'em a cooler of beer each and a couple shot guns and deer huntin' rifles and a cooler of beer each and tell 'em that the terrorists desecrated the American flag, then let 'em loose...problem solved...(wait maybe desecrated is too big...tell them they dishonored the flag...yeah that's better)

Bingo, no more war lets bring on the peace!

[Guest]

Tell slick that!!!!!

he posts in this and my thread... soooooooo idk, i say we cast him off the island!

[Guest]

Hmm is it a bit hypocritical to post both here and the war club?

If so, oh well

Anyway, I do agree that peace is needed, war is annoying, terrorism is pointless. What we really need to end this war and begin a search for peace is to:

1# send in a group of hardened gang members, put them in some Cadillacs and old vans, drop em in Iraq and have them do drive-bys on all the terrorists.

If that doesn't work then

#2 Get a bunch of rednecks, give 'em a cooler of beer each and a couple shot guns and deer huntin' rifles and a cooler of beer each and tell 'em that the terrorists desecrated the American flag, then let 'em loose...problem solved...(wait maybe desecrated is too big...tell them they dishonored the flag...yeah that's better)

Bingo, no more war lets bring on the peace!

1. Exactly Whom are you going to send them to....President Bush? Condilsa Rice? (sp) Rudy Giuliani??

2. How is promoting violence through "rednecks" or "gangs" peaceful?

[Guest]

1. Exactly Whom are you going to send them to....President Bush? Condilsa Rice? (sp) Rudy Giuliani??

2. How is promoting violence through "rednecks" or "gangs" peaceful?

because rednecks and gangs we could do without... so they kill each other and everything is peaceful =D

[Guest]

because rednecks and gangs we could do without... so they kill each other and everything is peaceful =D

Actually I was talkin' about sending them after the terrorists...and hey now, i'm half redneck....

[Guest]

Actually I was talkin' about sending them after the terrorists...and hey now, i'm half redneck....

lol so am i

okay terrorists it is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Guest]

There is an Eskimo tradition/expression that says a person is not gone until all the people who's hearts they have touched are gone too

Today is a good day to think of peace world wide - I went first thing to Amsterdam for a remembrance of the day where I heard the most shocking news of my life - I wish never see anything like it or hear of it again.

My thoughts today for the Innocent people that can not be here today, but more importantly for those that have to carry that grief inside for friends and relatives

IS there anyway that we can find something good out from this abhorrent act, so that those who have left us can have achieved more than they already have?

LIS

....... I did not know of anyone that perished personally, but I am very lucky to know two survivors that were supposed to be there, missed their flights.

[Guest]

Hmm is it a bit hypocritical to post both here and the war club?

If so, oh well

Anyway, I do agree that peace is needed, war is annoying, terrorism is pointless. What we really need to end this war and begin a search for peace is to:

1# send in a group of hardened gang members, put them in some Cadillacs and old vans, drop em in Iraq and have them do drive-bys on all the terrorists.

If that doesn't work then

#2 Get a bunch of rednecks, give 'em a cooler of beer each and a couple shot guns and deer huntin' rifles and a cooler of beer each and tell 'em that the terrorists desecrated the American flag, then let 'em loose...problem solved...(wait maybe desecrated is too big...tell them they dishonored the flag...yeah that's better)

Bingo, no more war lets bring on the peace!

This to me highlights a problem with how terrorism seems to be perceived, particularly in the USA. Once upon a time when two bunches of people didn't like each other they would kit up with swords and shields (or later, guns), line up on opposite sides of a field, then march forward and kill each other until only one side was left. Ah, those were the days! However, terrorists don't play that game any more. You can't just go and "kill the terrorists" because you don't know where, or for the most part, who, the terrorists are. They won't even line up neatly! They hide amongst innocent people. And if you try to kill the terrorists you end up killing lots of innocent people, and then, guess what? Many more people become so appalled by your actions and the jingoistic ignorance that drives them, that they are persuaded to become terrorists or support terrorism. You cannot have a war on terrorism. All it does is make more terrorists. Terrorism is not a country. It is not a political movement, or an organisation. It is a form of behaviour. It is what happens when ordinary civilians are driven to such extremes that they feel it is their moral duty to abandon a peaceful existence and take up the gun and the bomb. What provokes this? Answer that and then you can start to combat terrorism.

PS. I agree with solemnraven that the terror threat has been falsified to control public opinion, though I wouldn't go so far as to say that 9-11 was an "inside job". The US government may have turned a blind eye to the threat (until after the event) but IMHO that seems to be mainly due to blinkered incompetence.

[Guest]

There is an Eskimo tradition/expression that says a person is not gone until all the people who's hearts they have touched are gone too

Today is a good day to think of peace world wide - I went first thing to Amsterdam for a remembrance of the day where I heard the most shocking news of my life - I wish never see anything like it or hear of it again.

My thoughts today for the Innocent people that can not be here today, but more importantly for those that have to carry that grief inside for friends and relatives

IS there anyway that we can find something good out from this abhorrent act, so that those who have left us can have achieved more than they already have?

LIS

....... I did not know of anyone that perished personally, but I am very lucky to know two survivors that were supposed to be there, missed their flights.

A couple friends of mine lost an aunt in that disaster. I almost fainted when I saw it collapse on TV because I was in the first tower that went down August 11, 2001. The visual was overwhelming, For a second I thought it was a movie, until I realized that I was watching the news...

[akaslickster]

Copied and pasted & Written by Duh Puck.

Well guys, it's been a while. I decided to drop by and see how my fellow BDenizens were faring, and stumbled on this thread. I see that the only requirement for joining is that "you really hate war and want world peace." Since that's a statement I wholeheartedly endorse, I would like to join.

That makes the updated member list as follows:

Drydung, Lemonymelon, Akaslickster, Yellowsubmarine, Greycells, Unreality, Crazypainter, F_I_F, Twoaday, Bobbob, Nayana, Pw0nzd, Tolecnal, Frost, ROF, Lenochka, Mekal, Kat, Squirt, Dusty, Dnae, Ben Law, Rene83, Yoktado, Rockstar, Firebirdaz, Ravi, Phaze, Pacman Rules, Solemnraven, Peace*out, Cryptic chic, New guest, Woon, Engspangussian, Marinja, JIThu, Octopuppy, Blade, Duh Puck

However, I know I have a different perspective on this topic than others. In previous threads I've expressed my opinion that peace will not be achieved simply through collaborative goodwill. I believe the corrupting factors that have plagued human society throughout history are deeply ingrained and will not be erased by education. That I believe peace will be achieved through God's intervention is probably not relevant to the intent of this thread, so I won't be promoting my religious views.

Nevertheless, I do have a few observations on the topic of religion and peace.

First of all, I completely agree that religion as a whole is complicit in the lack of peace. As has already been mentioned, many conflicts have started as a direct result of religious differences. Others may have centered around economic or territorial concerns, yet religions clearly lined up on opposing sides. And in practically every conflict, regardless of the cause, the religious powers who position themselves as beacons of moral guidance are found promoting whatever side their parishioners favor, thus fomenting the hatred. When the clergy tell the people to pray for the troops, what are they really saying? They're instructing them to ask God to bless slaughter. Mark Twain wonderfully highlighted this hypocrisy in a short piece called The War Prayer.

Religion is obviously not the sole cause of divisiveness among humans. Skin color, national membership, language, tribal membership, political ideology, and pretty much any characteristic that can be used to categorize people have been used as a basis for fighting. What makes religion particularly culpable, however, is that it claims to represent a guiding system of belief encompassing moral standards. In other words, religion claims to teach right and wrong, so when a priest says to kill, followers act because they believe it is the "right" thing to do. When these actions clearly contradict our objective sense of moral rightness, we understandably become disgusted with the hypocrisy, and the desire to do away with the corrupt organized structures of religion achieves broad appeal (although most are still accepting of individual religious belief, practiced peaceably).

Does that mean, however, that the very concept of religion is to blame for this state of affairs? If you are a staunch atheist, you might conclude that all religion is essentially a lie, and that it will therefore never serve a positive purpose. Others will admit that the core teachings of most religions are admirable (be kind, don't steal or kill, display modesty, etc.), but recognize that such ideology often has little force in people's lives. On the other hand, it's an obvious truth that if everyone on the planet were to personally follow the teachings of Jesus, there wouldn't be war, so if the religions which claim to follow Jesus are responsible for war, where is the fault?

Spoiler for Side Point: Is Christianity based on Peace?:

Earlier, Unreality said that religions like Islam and Christianity "claim to be based on peace, but one look at their holy books and it's really not." I can't speak for the Qur'an, but I am familiar with the Bible, and I'd have to say there's a problem with that generalization. I assume that what he means is that the Bible clearly depicts God backing the Israelites in war, even giving commands to kill the women and children in a few cases. Such actions were described as executions of God's judgments on the wicked people of the surrounding nations, but many people see in such stories the same hypocritical exploitation of religious fervor as I mentioned earlier.

I'm not going to try to defend that here, but I will note that "Christianity" is based on the teachings of Jesus. The writings in the New Testament, regardless of whether you believe them to be true or not, clearly say that the nation of Israel was rejected and a new, spiritual nation would be chosen from all peoples of the earth, and that these followers of the new teaching of Jesus would be peaceful, would be "no part of the world", and would follow the command to "love your enemy." Therefore, to claim that Christianity is not based on peace because there is God-ordained war in the Bible is a mischaracterization of Christianity. The responsibility for the bloodshed of so-called Christianity lies, not with the "holy book", but with the corrupt organizations that abused it.

Spoiler for I said I wouldn't promote my religious views, but here's my plug:

Personally, I have seen how my chosen religion has indeed been a unifying force for peace. For the past century, Jehovah's Witnesses have established an international brotherhood which unites across racial and national boundaries. Because war is entirely in opposition to Christ's teachings, this has resulted in tremendous persecution. During WWII, JW's were persecuted in the U.S. for being Nazi-sympathizers because they wouldn't fight, while at the same time tens of thousands of them were being imprisoned in Nazi camps because they wouldn't "Heil Hitler". All they had to do to avoid this was sign a piece of paper. According to Wikipedia:

Refusing to pledge allegiance to the Nazi party or to serve in the military, roughly 12,000 Jehovah's Witnesses were forced to wear a purple triangle and placed in camps, where they were given the option of renouncing their faith and submitting to the state's authority. Between 2,500 and 5,000 were killed.[35] Historian Detlef Garbe, director at the Neuengamme (Hamburg) Memorial, writes that "no other religious movement resisted the pressure to conform to National Socialism with comparable unanimity and steadfastness."

Similar things have happened repeatedly in other places, including Russia, Rwanda (JW Hutus protected Tutsis, and vice versa), and where I currently live, in South Korea, where every young JW male goes to prison for a couple years because he won't join the military.

I have personally traveled to many countries and have witnessed firsthand the international unity of this religious organization. They are true promoters of peace. So when you claim that "religion" is responsible for war, it is important to recognize that it doesn't have to be. People who are serious about promoting peace should be willing adhere to peaceful principles even at personal cost. Such an application of genuine Christian principles has already resulted in an organization that transcends the divisive barriers.

Just as corruption, greed, pride, and hunger for power are responsible for the failings of government, these same influences are responsible for the failure of religious organizations to do what they should.

In any case, I would ask all of you who have joined the club so far: How far would you personally be willing to go to promote peace? How serious are you?

Welcome aboard, Duh Puck

Edited September 12, 2008 by akaslickster