41 replies to this topic

[KlueMaster]

Just 1 question, are these numbers following decimal number system?

[araver]

Hmmm...

Spoiler for Is this a correct application?

-4 */* -2 = 0

I'm caught up in matrices.

Nope. Interesting thoughts though.

Just 1 question, are these numbers following decimal number system?

I don't want to answer that question as I consider it a fun-spoiler. Assume an answer, try to decipher and if it doesn't work, assume the converse is true. It's supposed to be a message received from aliens after all
All that the OP states is that the message was written down and passed on to you as it was received (e.g. four beeps and a pause were translated as 4 because this is how *we* write 4 using the decimal numbering system).

[KlueMaster]

All that the OP states is that the message was written down and passed on to you as it was received (e.g. four beeps and a pause were translated as 4 because this is how *we* write 4 using the decimal numbering system).

ah, now you are making me think in binary, and more so in morse and braille

[araver]

ah, now you are making me think in binary, and more so in morse and braille

I can't really stop you think at anything.
All the OP says is the message we received. The rest is, as the title suggests, a mystery.
As I said, the decimal numbering system is there to transmit a message between humans - you would not want the OP to say: "beep beep beep beep pause beep beep pause beep beep beep beep beep."
It's simply simpler for humans to convey the information (4,2,5) in a decimal way e.g "4 beeps pause 2 beeps pause 5 beeps big pause ... makes us think there's a relationship between those beeps before the big pause."

[k-man]

I can't really stop you think at anything.
All the OP says is the message we received. The rest is, as the title suggests, a mystery.
As I said, the decimal numbering system is there to transmit a message between humans - you would not want the OP to say: "beep beep beep beep pause beep beep pause beep beep beep beep beep."
It's simply simpler for humans to convey the information (4,2,5) in a decimal way e.g "4 beeps pause 2 beeps pause 5 beeps big pause ... makes us think there's a relationship between those beeps before the big pause."

Well, you just confirmed that these numbers are decimal numbers. The OP dosn't just talk about the message. It also provides a particular interpretation of the message. Should we not assume that the interpretation of the message is correct and think of possible different interpretations? That is what I was trying to find out when I asked my previous question about the narrative containing hidden clues. Is the puzzle about finding a mystery operation based on the interpretation given in the OP or is it about interpreting the message and figuring out how to respond to 48 beeps followed by 73 beeps?

[Molly Mae]

*Sigh*

Semantics.

Spoiler for Just my rambling...

I've looked at base 4 and 5 with very little success. Maybe I'm not seeing it. I've also considered a variable base dependant upon the second number. I've looked at factors of both numbers. The larger the numbers get, the further from true my answers become. Perhaps...

...I broke it?

Hmm...

[araver]

Well, you just confirmed that these numbers are decimal numbers. The OP dosn't just talk about the message. It also provides a particular interpretation of the message. Should we not assume that the interpretation of the message is correct and think of possible different interpretations? That is what I was trying to find out when I asked my previous question about the narrative containing hidden clues. Is the puzzle about finding a mystery operation based on the interpretation given in the OP or is it about interpreting the message and figuring out how to respond to 48 beeps followed by 73 beeps?

OK, it's hard to push for one part of the puzzle and ignore the rest using the same logic, but I will try to clarify:
1) The fact that you're looking at a mysterious operation is forced in the OP (it's not hidden and it just restricts the puzzle to a very large field of possibilities)
2) The fact that the numbers represent in the decimal system the number of "beeps" is also given (from my previous response). It just a matter of easy communication (among us, humans) of how many beeps were received. So when the OP says (x, y, z) it does imply that x beeps then y beeps then z beeps were received.
3) The fact that the operation actually considers these numbers / looks at them in a decimal number system is neither given nor contradicted by the OP.
Another way to look at it is this: Imagine the same race as in Mystery Operation 1. They use base 3. If they would want to transmit number 4, the easiest/unambiguous way would be to transmit 4 beeps (which does not depend on the particular numbering system any receiving race might have). If they transmit "beep space beep" (11), then 11=4 only for races that use 3 as a numbering system. So, it seems that the inherently unambiguous way to transmit a number is to just transmit the same number of beeps. Of course, any receiving race would write it down in their own numbering system, but no receiving race should (Occam's Razor) assume that the transmitting race transmitted digits in their own numbering system. Think of it as a sort of "Assume it's numbers not digits, as digits may lead to ambiguity" golden rule of interspecies communication, ok?

*Sigh*

Semantics.

Spoiler for Just my rambling...

I've looked at base 4 and 5 with very little success. Maybe I'm not seeing it. I've also considered a variable base dependant upon the second number. I've looked at factors of both numbers. The larger the numbers get, the further from true my answers become. Perhaps...

...I broke it?

Hmm...

Spoiler for

Everything you say is true. There's nothing broken, I double checked.

Edited by araver, 14 December 2010 - 08:27 PM.

[Molly Mae]

Spoiler for

Everything you say is true. There's nothing broken, I double checked.

Nah, I trust you know what you're doing. I broke my pencil lead. I went all anime and just stared at it in disbelief, my eyes asking: "Why would you break on me? Have I wronged you in some way?"

...

I'm going to go back to the problem at hand, though.

Spoiler for

121. Coincidentally (or not), it's also the sum of the two numbers.

[araver]

Spoiler for

121. Coincidentally (or not), it's also the sum of the two numbers.

No.

[araver]

Adding another example to the challenge:

4 */* 2 = 5
12 */* 17 = 28
30 */* 10 = 36
100 */*	93 = 186
42 */* 35 = 72
------------------
48 */* 73 = ?